signals
try removing ios

cout AB; }

expected type-specifier before '(' token

"B=()"?
that doesn't make any sense

oops, struct

also, #geordi

in line 31
you have ; that is irrelevant
at the end of afunction

I
I'm rather confused, though. It's supposed to be a library, but I don't see a .so file anywhere.

!next

Another satisfied customer. Next!

I just have a .la (libtool file) and .a

I'm fairly sure .a is a valid library extension

I hate it when I try to type ' and hit enter :/
..a is a static library

in fact, I have *lots* of stuff ending in .a in /usr/lib

.a is just an ar archive. It actually has a bunch of smaller .so inside it.
Er, .o

neat, but Bigcheese answered you.

But… I have a bad feeling about this.

heh , starwars

well good night all happy coding

It's morning
LOL
he lives on the other side of earth

Any idea how I can tell libtool to make a dynamic library?

Normally it does that by default.

say "lease"
*please

I've no idea
raw
In bed.

I think the default here was a static host library. Reading the manual for the library I compiled seems to confirm it.

configure –enable-shared ?

Indeed.
I do hope this doesn't mean I need to rebuild the whole thing. It took about an hour to compile.

Next time, configure –help
It almost certainly does mean that.

And it's unmaintained software, so I kept running into snags.

JordiGH:sucks…
Ihope for you it'll work

yeah, I know how that is. It'll be a rebuild, though.

If one wants to have a unixy environment on Vista, what alternative is there other than cygwin?
Because Vista's a PITA with cygwin (And other apps in general, but that's another issue…)

One of those snags had me stumped for close to four hours. I felt mostly relieved when I found the solution, which turns out was that I had introduced myself trying to get out of another snag.

!pastebin

Paste your code to http://cpp.sf.net/ or http://rafb.net/paste. Do _not_ use http://pastebin.* sites, and not http://nomorepasting.* sites. Do _not_ paste it in the channel.

Eh? Are you telling me to paste?

no
he was looking it up for himself

have anyone heard about stereograms?

yeah

even made a few

because i want to make stereogram maker for linux with SDL
!SDL

SDL is the Simple Direct Media Library ( libsdl.org ) - A cross-platform API for single window and fullscreen 2D graphics, audio, joystick, keyboard, mouse, and OpenGL access, with a ton of addon libraries available

I Love nolyc! he is so cute
Do you want to join me

I'd advise finding a good image processing lib and checking wikipedia to start finding out the technical specifics of how they're made. I used a tool built into a 3D suite.

?

no thanks.

Ok
can you recommand on a good image host processing lib?

nope

Hmm you might try ImageMagick although it is a horror to use with C++

but I think SDL gives me all what I need

in all fairness, java is also a horror to use from C++

just curious, what is wrong with pastebin sites?

how they do line numbering
and formating
and whatnot

ah k

I can save images as BMP
and load any format to SDL_Surface with SDL_Image
cimg looks good
(image processing lib)

but I'm thinking you probably don't want to perform your image oprations on the raw binary data.

that's what i was thinking of
it's header only

for the truth, that what I planned to do
what header only?

cimg is header only
I think

It's a dev package…
one header must be included with the source thats all

hi, regarding for_each, I have for_each(iterator, iterator, function), how can I declare function to take as a parameter a non const reference ?

how can i get file list of some directory and recognize which of the files are directories?
for example -file browser

man stat
or man fstat

sys/stat.h
yes?

yes gnudles

I have the st_mode of the struct stat
can I trust the number?
of st_mode?

man stat, lstat fstat

how do i get out of the manual pages in the terminal?
I tried ctrl+D, ctrl+C, ESCAPE

q
lol
q for quit

thank you LOL
man man

woman man

what?

I know the feeling.. when I first ran linux, I got stuck in lots of apps
and I wasn't running X..

you have to learn the standards
all ten million of them

this works, but how to get the value of myarray["somevar"] .. ?

someone told me vi was great, and it ended up pissing me off a great deal at first
took a few years for me to give it a second chance

not as great as emacs ^_^

vi is struct stat, nano is better\
*frustrating
XD

nano is something completely different

they do the same work…
I think..
vi scares me…

vi's a good example of something where the people who have become accustomed to it are out of touch with what it's like for people who are seeing it for the first time
though if you've used it for a while, it's great — for you
it's an antisocial way of working that I'm still getting used to

my dad tries to use vi commands in notepad…

Yeah, same work. Just about the same amont of work you have to do to travel cross country on foot and by car.
(vim is the car)

(he works on a secure linux web hosting pc all day at work)

Just the thing that you have to explicitly pass an argument to nano to avoid it chomping the end of your lines should be warning enoug.

I keep accidentally hitting emacs key combos in my web browser and bringing up all kinds of dialogs

lol

"Emacs is not just an editor, its a way of life"

Is there any reason for the following line to fail (both tv_sec and tv_usec are long ints..)? currentTime = static_castuint64_t(epochTime.tv_sec*MILLION) + static_castuint64_t(epochTime.tv_usec);
The ? should have been in front of the (), I know that they are long ints

LOL

current time is of type uint64_t

how come I can supply to for_each a function that takes a non const reference argument for a vector, but not for a map ?

was that *LOL* a response to my question?

!testcase

A testcase is a single small source file (which we can compile) demonstrating a problem. It consists only of code directly contributing to the problem - everything else must be cut. #include only stdlib headers. Insert compiler errors as comments with correct line numbers. Describe logic errors by specifying both expected and actual output. See http://jcatki.no-ip.org/fncpp/Test

look up ^^^

I get the point But the thing is, my program works fine for a random time, then something weird happens. It is a huge multithreaded program.. just wanted to know if casting like this could cause problems in the long run..

Maybe you have an overflow.

I have been thinking about that, but if a long int is 32bit it should not overflow until year 2036 or something..
holding the seconds since epoch

2038.

Thank you

!next

Another satisfied customer. Next!

hehe
I take it noone noticed anything wrong with that line then
I am currently experiencing what i call, the tuning hell, when you have more than 20 threads in your app and you need micro seconds resolution, things might get a bit frustrating..
I found the bug by the way.. kernel bug

go to linux channel and report

hello if i have a mapint,int

uskateboards are slow on any but the perfect terrain, it's actually _a lot_ more energy than walking, injury prone in your ankles and body parts that hit the ground inevitably due to the fact that you can't just "step off it", because you're stood on it, it'll slip/u

sdfa

I figure that if a bear can manage it …

I figure anything with a reasonably flexible brain can manage it

I keep thinking of Dean Ing's books, where the characters use a powered version with a extensible handle and seat, brakes, etc

I suppose this is one of the cases where the extreme inefficiency of our motor control sections is a good thing.

hmm, not sure that they're particularly inefficient

The only good skateboard is a flying skateboard. And frankly, I'd rather have a flying ornithopter.

well, actually - humans have pretty fine control.

I never said it didn't /work/

I suspect sensors on the ankle/feet and hands would freak out most data-acquisitions.

It's highly suspicious that neuron count for those sections is proportional to body mass, as opposed to, say, joint count and fine-motor fineness
Well, that's really just another victim of the /slowness/ of said neurons. Can't run any loops.

just balancing on our "flippers" is a major chore

well, I'd suggest that it's proportional mainly to muscle mass

Yeah, but mostly for biological reasons. We're not /meant/ to go upside down; all the blood-pressure bits have a fixed orientation.

this cd is slow — 18 meg up

Granted, but that's equally suspicious. There's absolutely no reason why scaling up a motor means you have to scale up the MCU.

bio/evol anyway.. There must be a shitload of i/o between toes, feet, ankles; fingers, hands and the brain.

and spine

it would if muscle fiber bundles had an ideal range of sizes that were largely independent of total body sizwe

well, that's the pipeline.. I meant sensors/feedback-motors

all those reflexes that go to the spine and never reach the brain

in which case as body mass increased, the number of control points would likewise increase

Even if you have to use more fibers, it should be possible to have a single control line and duplicate the signal at the muscle side

well, the brain has inhibitory control
well, ou have ganglia scattered about, but sure — it's not a very efficient scaling system

I wonder about that. Take breathing - I'm always aware of how I'm breathing (as I can remember it if I need to), but I'm not usually aware of being aware.

but it's very flexible
grafting additional limbs onto frogs, for example, works fine.

That's certainly true. Brute-force approaches tend to be.

well, I don't think that it's brute force
I suspect some kind of broadcast system with coded dispatches

Call it what you like. It's the same reason why our intelligence works, so I'm okay with it.

what's the discussion on?

unicycles

C
data-structures and containers

Massively parallel, slow-frequency CPUs

there are those unconscious reflexes, I mean. such as putting your hand on something hot and your arm shoots out, and where you hit your knee and the leg kicks out

similar to a brain

Yes. Quite.

oh, hey - wanted to ask y'all: Have you ever done so many malloc/free that you "ran out of memory" due to fragmentation?

well, I don't think that brains are cpus

of course they aren't

No, they're not very C

yes, but mainly due to mixing them with mmaps

anyone who thinks so is terribly deficient in understanding even the basics of biology

umm, brains are certainly CPU

malloc/free slice up the address space something bad.

ahhhh

One solution to that sort of workload is to introduce a compacting GC

heh, something baayd

yes, I wondered about that.. Never seen one.

Another is to get a 64-bit cpu; you still get fragmentation but not as badly
(IIRC, mallocs commonly have proofs that they'll waste no more than 20-40% of the memory they get, worst case)

yeah, Baughn - that's what I thought

A compacting GC, of course, can drive that percentage arbitrarily close to 0 at increasing cost in CPU time

hmm.. Never seen such for C.

Well, they're usually implemented *in* C
It's just that you have to use special functions and tagged data to deal with it
As you've already swallowed half the cost of a high-level language at that point, most just use a HLL

it would cost more to use that in C than to implement a HLL…

boehm-gc, of course, is /not/ compacting. It can't be.
Indeed
Though the cost might be in programmer time. That's nothing new.

exactly
that stuff isn't exactly cheap

You could trade off specialization to get a /slow/ gc that /reduces/ programming time

hmm

But given that the programming you'd be trading off is exactly the sort of thing a compiler is good at…

well, when it gets too slow that also wastes programmer's time…

I doubt it'd be that bad, for most purposes

well, I was thinking of a shell anyway.. Maybe I just need to step-off and review i/o

It's just, well, useless. You could use a better language and improve on C w/GC in all respects.

well, c (gcc) is my "assembler" - That's done and given. I just was worried whom could do which to where, whom and why.

well, speciali purpose GCs aren't hard to do in C.
just do the GC within an opaque structure

no, I imagine it'd just be an interface and abstraction
right

It's /supposed/ to be totally transparent, but C isn't good at abstractions

"OK, here comes input - oh, look: I #include…" etc, and then interpret-alloc vs "this is compiled"
yes, this is now the choir

was up

I believe my serious issue is in dealing with fopen vs open and friends and simply admitting everything is char/octet/byte-based. Instead of "words" and "lines", etc
btw, how many levels of #include are allowed by the stds?

42.

for real?
usually, it's a power of 2
oh, yer just being cute.. nm

moi? cute?

I have a function that returns a char* and its used like printf( "%s", getCurrentTime()) and its returning the wrong data

I'd say its what ever your stacksize/sizeof(void*);

does linux use clr
does linux use clr

clr?

I bet you returned a pointer to a local variable

PoppaVic, 15.

common language runtime

Auris-: ok, so 16 is the std "limit"

what am I doing wrong then?

Randy, is that a proper noun ?

I thought so, Auris- ..32 and 64 sounded quite extreme

i dont know

I suggest you find out.

ok
why do you use so many verbs

if you had a book, and you had done the exercises, you'd realize that C has no idea about "a screen"

Can I give you more info for some help?

nope

i see

Is there anyone here who can help me understand?

!book luke_

you just need the right compile lol

luke_, understand what?

I have several books but this is a specific question

books cover all the knowledge you need.

I beg to differ like I said I have several books

I would 100% expect that those books and a few tests will save you
either that, or those books blow, or you are just lazy

you can't return local allocated variables, out of scope, do you use malloc ?

luke_ "its returning the wrong data" have you feed it the right info ?

your very quick to judge.

I am old, too - I've seen most everything.

Ok here is how the function works. It returns a char* but I put the return variable into a char[]

you have a prob, you want our help, and you can't form a decent question.

Now when I used a char* the data is truncated but when I use the char[] it returns a pointer
uNow when I used a char* the data is truncated but when I use the char[] it returns a pointer/u

yeah, I'm mean - and everyone that has asked you has told you the clue you need.

luke_, dont 'read' the code at me, that is what paste bins are for.

any good sites on creating makefiles for linux compilers?

makefiles??

Randy, which linux compiler are you talking about ?

If this room is for C programmers and help why are you here. All you seem to do is make fun of others. Perhaps if you so old and seen so many things you would be more helpful rather than condesending

gcc

well, I can ship you an example
gimme' an email

is the variable OUT OF SCOPE?

why papa let me create a yahoo one hold on

Randy, then ask in #gcc or #gnu

it could be.

right thanks
zaps
sorry

this is a common issue with wannabe: we are NOT here to replace your books, practice, manpages, class, google, etc.
all I need is a mailto

it "could be"? do you not know, and if it is, this is the problem, like I told you before you decided to go all whiny

/msg me if you can

luke_, pastebin your code. and we will find the 1st problem, and direct you on how to help yourself to fix it.

ok give me a few minutes

Do I paste it in here?

No.

Where is the pastebin?

/topic

paste

http://rafb.net/paste

I've a tarball that works for linux and osX, demonstrating a static, static-lib, shared lib and plugin with "hello world" If you change anything, tell me.

ok

It has been posted

paste the link, please

http://rafb.net/p/gWb6cm33.html

aw, I was hoping no one would ask

'return thing the wrong data' isn't specific

hah, I called it!
on top of that, it's c++ even

luke_ ##c++

Yes I know

what is the extent of an array?
for what duration of time does it exist?

Well the char* is returned to a printf function

luke_, what is the scope of ret? as juanmabc had pointed out _hours_ ago ?

I am not sure.

where does that char * point?

to a temporary variable.

do you understand scope?

wrong
it points into the array ret.

Yes but in this sense with C++ and C the scope may be different

no
when does the array it points into get deallocated?

hehehehaha!

Pappavic, thunderstruck1337@yahoo.com

Ok help me to understand.

ok, give me a sec here..

"may be different". yet another random coder.

Read about variable scope in your book.

answer my question

Here is the problem

your problem is that you are too stupid to answer questions.
please come back when you are more intelligent.

Technically the ret variable should give a return and then be deallocated after the printf function executes

so, where is that pointer pointing?

you need to allocate dynamic memory with malloc, and free it when you're done, that in c

Says who ?

you should see an attachment asap

printf( "%s", getCurrentTIme())

and why do you think it should be deallocated after printf?
do you have a book on C++?

Yes

read it — your ideas are wrong.
read about scope and extent.

i'll check it out when i get home

I will thanx Zhivag. BTW try not to be such pretentious jerks. Its my advice to some of you. Stupid is a term only used by those who are.

yay, advice.

)

I suggest that he be pretentious enough to spell "it's" properly.

what I did was write it to test osX, at all levels - then share it around for linux folks. I've been adding to it as needed,

lol

I don't think your comments are contributing to the channel

I think OBVIOUSLY by speaking unprovoked to such a distinguished person as Zhivago you have demonstrated that you are INCREDIBLY stupid. Emphasis on stupid.

well, it's a pair of dead-stupid makefiles with a set of sourcefiles that just do the same things in different places.

i noticed
as you said c has no screen

but C can scream

i would agree if i knew more about it, i need to study more

Uff

Well, Randy - foog luck with it.. At least I tried, If you try, you may get lucky
foog/good

i might

Randy, the chapters in your book are ordered for a reason. Do not go to chapter 2 under you understand chapter 1.
bRandy, the chapters in your book are ordered for a reason. Do not go to chapter 2 under you understand chapter 1./b

putting down this deitel book, physically falling apart in sections. I'm just going to start with k&r.

worse - he wanted makefiles - in ##C

sysfault, the book is falling apart?

yea, it's in bad condition.
c how to program 3rd edition, had it for a while. I bought it used anyhow.

glues and clamps. binders

I'll just start with k&r, and read programming pearls after it

C is… interesting
By itself, it's simple as hell - and useless.

sysfault_, you've got the book, download the PDF of it… its not stealing, its format-shifting.

Implementation, and getting familiar with the standard library is when the fun begins.

yeppers
Bothering to care HOW is the bitch

uf

At some point you end up screaming "FUCKIT - just do this, you silly bugger"

with mailing lists, faqs, testing, documentation, time and you guys, I'm ready..

for what

To learn C.

"Hello, world".

Hello, wSegmentation fault.

And to use it officially and productively when and where needed. I'm a python evangelist, but I know the advantages of learning C. Any system administrator should at least have basic knowledge of the language.

I…'d disagree

hey
im trying to compile a program that uses the getch() before exiting
9: error: conio.h: No such file or
what header do i need

isn't conio a library from old C compilers mainly used in DOS?

no one learns C without the blood and sweat and tears.. Really.

exactly, time.

yeppers
the "exercise" of the "learning"

This connection depresses me.

is it better to start learning C or C++ ?

better?

well, they blow - replace it or suffer it
YES - now go away

I don't plan on being a knowledgeable and productive C programmer without time and experience. I have the rest of my life, and as long as I'm capable I'll better myself. Until the day I die actually…

well, when you stop learning/appreciating: yer dead.

why ? whats wrong with what i said/asked

pretty much.

define "better" unambiguously and we might answer your question.

better for a beginner to c/c++
easier

that's still pretty ambiguous. we don't know how you'd plan to learn or what you want to do with either language.
uthat's still pretty ambiguous. we don't know how you'd plan to learn or what you want to do with either language./u

you're learning c?

is there a K&R pdf on the net ?

he seems to want to be _aware_, as far as "well shit is happening as I manage the system"

for download

It's not a "bad thing" to at least be aware of basics.
brb

wb

tanks
well, at least I don't bounce in and out every couple minutes

hah, indeed.
still doing anything interesting with pike, or to the pike language
?

no.. It was interesting, and think it has a future though

K&R states "… not an introductory programming manual; …", if you are learning to program also, I recommend C Primer Plus. Do all examples, exercises, etc.

hmm, must be the new version
this still presumes someone reads, eh?

;[

It states that in the preface to the first version, in the second version
uIt states that in the preface to the first version, in the second version/u

Thats where a lot of my focus is going to be, to the development of pike.

not one iota of that is wrong or bad
well, I wish you well. I was not seriously "over the top" impressed, but you may well have better luck.
I'm prolly too damned old and ossified to bother

did you see the benchmarks? The only thing pike lacks is a true user base, it has a vibrant developer community. Libraries come with contributions……

twot is pike ?

that's all nice, except you are expecting _me_ to be swayed by statistics and ideals for kids that still can't life w/o a videogame.
life/live
pike is another shell/interpreter, that is semi-portable, and talks near-C

((SoundWorld*)soundworld) = (soundworld is of the type void*) what is wrong with this case please ?

Hey

hello

i only ask because 'pike' in google does not seem to list it on the first page. which makes me think it must be non-popular.

I'm 20 years old, been through through a lot of trials and tribulations, more than the average actually, your stereotypes surely don't apply. Pretty serious about what I want…

it's another semipopular language
I've over double your age, and I can remember
as it goes, it's pretty nice.

;o

sysfault, what do you see as the main advantage of Pike compared with compiled C ?

I'm not young enough to care, however - and if it ends up Ruling The World, I can deal with it

â/join #python

it's an _interpreter_ - nteractive
interactive

I never argued advantages, just interests…

right
I find many interests. Every day
If I did not find ##C "interesting", I'd not be here.
You can't fault someone for "interests". You might disagree with them, or worse - but nothing mandates we all agree or like each other in this format.

sysfault, im not looking for an argument.

I should shower..
It's been a while.
I find the tv show "Weeds" interesting..

Pike is sorta' interesting.. Im suprised you can't find it and it's not grown in audience.
that's nice. I also like reading.

nothing is wrong with it in particulars

Certainly all material you read doesn't interest you..

indeed, found the error .. twas another statement on the same line, thanks

this is why I have a box for "get this the hell out of here"

oic

good evening

evening

I don't follow

Part of the growth process, we hunger.. Some languages are more keen. If pike's statistics, language structure, and language capabilities through easy idioms, to other languages, I'd say it knocks most out the box. It doesn't seem to be a real opinion to me anymore.

kioto is a place in japan, is it not?

I like what I like, and what interests me may not interest another: I can try and discard easily, but respect everything folks like (except Romance Novels)

that was directed to your last statement to me PoppaVic

kyoto yes

well the ones before last.

Heh, my mother is across the room firing employees over the phone.

well, if you like something, use it/read it. As long as you harm no one else.. Where is the harm?

jp

I read Learn Programming in Ten Years before, found part of it interesting, stating that one learns piano with instant feedback (you press the key, you hear the note)– you don't play the whole song and hear it after you've finished playing. likewise, it proposed, learning to program should
be the same; use an interactive language

right
This is why I recall the tp/tc and forth stuff quite fondly

aye

feedback is part of learning

Aer u learning how to c?
I read a bit of that learn programming in ten years thing..

interesting aside to that is some compiled languages support interactive prompts, like Haskell

It's not as though you have to submit a stack of punched cards and pick up your printout later. compile times are usually negligible now.

I just put it on my Sony Reader and read it all

What is a sony reader?

Does anyone which languages have never been made into interactive form?

Attempting to.

What are you reading?
(Book)

which is interpreted

it's a hand-held device with an electronic-ink screen (some clever tech. to simulate ink on paper) for reading books
has there been an interactive version of C?

deitel's book (c how to program 3rd edition). It's falling apart however, I have a copy of k&r beside me however. Been reading through the faq alongside..

Ah

some have attempted it yes…. C-shell has a "free lite version" which can actually execute some C programs, one line at a time

caught contact, darn marijuana.

I have Deitel's C++ book… didn't like it much

I believe that part of the issue is that folks will _not_ admit that "interpret" is the converse of "compile"

Here's what I did when I learnt C: Read the k&r, read it again and do the exercises, write/read a lot of code, work on other things
It's a rather simple transition; You just have to commit.

http://www.softintegration.com/docs/ch/shell/

I suppose as long as you can interpret it, you can run every sequence point literally. which would sadly mean it wouldn't protect you from fucking up, and it would crash if your compiled program would crash. but I think that would just be realistic, if all you wanted was to try an interactive
version of C, say, for learning

C is a rather small language — so a rather small book like the k&r would satisfy the request of learning basic c

Folks still don't "get it"

You can read 100,000 books and still come out with the same knowledge; It's what you implement that makes it all come together.

scroll up…

I can read a thousand books on hunting or reloading: neither make me a hunter or reloader.
practice might

Cin, did you check it out? What do you think?

nice

I have a friend, who learnt C purely from studying source.
I'd rather not scroll up right now.. I'm not really in the mood of reading lines.
hunting is fun.
We should go hunting for deer sometime; and cook it in your backyard

It's an interesting enough thing to check out.
nothing beats gcc, however, of course.

well, we cook in the house or out of the yard/garage/bbq: the hunting part is more amusing.

Yeah..

yeah, if I want to test something in C I've got a small script to compile something and execute it like $ ceval char *foo = "hello";
uyeah, if I want to test something in C I've got a small script to compile something and execute it like $ ceval char *foo = "hello";/u

I can read a cisco book, but if i never had any routers or any type of simulation, would i know networking?

RadSurfer, that Ch shell is not C. if it was, you could copypaste C programs into it and it would work.

1) I refuse to freeze; 2) don't "stalk"; 3) won't chase game; 4) I can match or outshit any sib, and help prep the meant, but refuse to freeze or hurt myself.

Auris-: he wasn't claiming it was

IT does!

You'd know the terminology.. but you really need to implement things properly, to gather a complete, concise understanding.

… if they are "simple/compatible" enough, they do work.

I can tell you about the is-is, igrp, eigrp protocols, but I've never worked on a cisco router.

Most any standard C-expression does work.

I'm aware of what it takes

I've used it for a while

Yes, but it's much like driving..

sound like "experience" again

I agree, its more of a curiousity than anything else.

believe it or not, I'm not agnostic nor ignorant of that fact.

You know where the ignition is, the clutch, steering wheel, etc.

maybe we need to say "suffering" instead of "experience"

You can read up about it.

you're discussing quales

But you really wouldn't know how to drive, until you drive.

yep

No matter how much you know about engines or what not.

right

did i ever say documentation was enough?

Did I?

that's what you're implying to my argument

no, but draichis is pointing out an issue that many, many people believe.

a woman can live in a dark, black and white room and watch a black and white TV for years, and understand everything about colours, how they interact with the brain, etc. but when she opens the door of the room to see the colour red, does she learn something new about the colour
red?

wasn't really an argument, more like a dialog.

yeppers
he made a _point_ of an "issue"

Intricate implementation in things such as programming is a requirement to become a greater coder
She learns that it's red.

there are all life issues that im aware of, it just doesn't have to be applied to C or programming at all.

yes, she learns what it's like to experience the colour red

what if what we agree is "red" is not what either of us _see_?

Then we'd have a big problem.

Reality.. What a concept

Reality is just a state of mind..

I think that's a pretty irrelevant topic, don't you?

why? Folks do it every day

Then they have nothing better to do, really..
Arguing over what 'red' actually is, isn't really development in my opinion.

not really. They are shooting at the underlayers
yep, I agree

Eitherway, all colours are made up of certain primary colours.
Red, blue, green.

it's pretty inconsequential that what we agree on to be "red" might actually be different in eachother's experiences of it

If I see blue, I just see blue - what you sent me is BLUE.
I can't change my own HW.

Only if you see it as 'blue'..

no, it leads up to the idea of agreements

if we have no control over the agreements, then it doesn't matter

it also suggests layers and interpreters and compilers: we don't give a shit how the job is done, we just want it done.
Somewhere along the line, I think folks decided they could "hide the source" with "binary libs/objects" that allll, magically, could never be decompiled.

int grad3[][] = {{1,1,0},{-1,1,0},{1,-1,0}} . . . copied from some Java code… but I don't know how to specify its type

Somewhere in that clusterfuck is where folks heads are. Saving size is a given, saving time is another.

Hodapp, so what's wrong with that?

Auris-: error: array type has incomplete element type

this is getting old.

no shit

int grad3[][3]

heh

It's my theory that certain people see colours differently; Some may see blue as a kaleidoscope of rainbow colours…

Auris-: tell him to instal cdecl

Hrm, lag.

you tell him!

What type is grad3?

Magic.

it's a boring, irrelevant theory

it doesn't matter, except at a HW level - because you are raised to agree with externals.

I agree with Cin on that.

So, why are you asking?

What? I was asking how to specify it because I didn't know. Auris- told me.

Yes, what type is grad3?

the hw of the "optic nerve" could vary, the brain translating could vary - all we care about is that "this is a 'blue'"

it's an array of (array of 3 ints).

the FUN part is when you start grouping/generalizing and shit works.
/because we are told "generalizations are BAD" ;-

Meh; I'm going to have dinner.

stay well
hehehe.. The silence

did I get draichis's question right?

yeah

sup people

bonsoir à tous

frenchman.

printf("shiver in eternal darkness/n");

lo. cartucho

I seriously hope that awesome muscian is not a C programmer

sup pop
barfh coming back from work, im making pizzas hahah

here? today? comparisons? Don't scare me.
another amusing day.

http://pastebin.com/d4be05f71

yep at least i ate some peperonni pizza aahah

man, I do NOT miss "food service"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Printf%28%22shiver_in_eternal_darkness/n%22%29%3B

every day is Eternal Darkness - and I suspect the endgame will be worse.

maybe because you are calling malloc with 0 ?

heh who cares what the name is
most album names are just meaningless bollocks

I worry about names and words every day

your crash(-1) crashes ? :p

isn't size_t unsigned?

I can tell

yeah it is

yeah but whats the catch, you are allocing 0 bytes, and trying to use it.

i think it's the same as `unsigned int'

well, all I have are my eyes and ears for commo

how buf[0] will work if its 0bytes ?

non he's not trying to use it because malloc would return null

exactly

its working ?
this is undefined behavior.

anyway, I might as well call it a knight. Everyone stay well!

but the program would not work if size_t is unsigned

if size_t is unsigned
and i try to use -1 as a size_t
and add 1 to it
will it be 0?
i always forget how signedness and all that two's complement shit works

you just can't call a function that takes an unsigned int with a negative int
am i wrong ?

you are.
the negative value will be converted to unsigned.

lol

cartucho is right

alright then compile with Wall would stop you from doing shit ?

it ends up as a 0
which malloc accepts i seem to recall reading

neumbeuroin1, warnings are not errors.

yeah

like in the openbsd man page

compile with all warnings and warnings as errors

it says if you pass it 0 it'll return an address
i.e. no null
but if you try to assign to it, segfault
i guess glibc does something completely retarded
cause it doesn't crash instantly
but hey, what's new
freebsd crashes instantly as well

i havent followed the conversation but why would anybody want to do something like pass -1 as a suize_t?

no, you are retarded for mallocing a block with size 0.

thats asking for trouble
yeah, thats retarded too.

and function returning an error is not a crash.

i am writing a program and like to test with weird values

ah.
a little hint

i am always asking for trouble, i thrive on it

is there an efficient (less then O(n)) way to count the bits set in an int?

use assert statements liberally
to make sure values are always in range of what's expected

when a function expects double* as a parameter, how can I insert a pointer of a double for it
of course I could do double* bla;bla = &realdouble;functionwhichexpectsdoublepointer(bla); but is there a shorter way?

& is address-of notation

http://graphics.stanford.edu/~seander/bithacks.html

when testing/debugging or in general?

would this be a pointer arke?

yeah

just the address of it?
ah great
I'll try it

Auris-, thanks

double myDouble;
foo(&myDouble);

kk

arke, it is better to make your functions not crash on any input, but asserts can be used in testing to see that your values are usually correct.

Auris-: well yeah, that too.

ha, wow, this song has a 11/4 time signature

Auris-: although there are rare cases where its better to not litterl the function with ifs
uAuris-: although there are rare cases where its better to not litterl the function with ifs/u

sure.

I'm incompatible with anything but 4/4 it seems.

i prefer doll, doll, doll to shiver in eternal darkness
all vsnares stuff is good though

my favourites are Cavalcade Of Glee and Dadaist Happy Hardcore and Rossz Csillag Allat Szuletett

oh yeah rossz is awesome as well

xD
did you know he learned to play the voilin and trumpet for that album?

i don't really remember much of cavalcade, maybe it didn't make much of an impression or maybe i haven't listened to it much
nope
cool

Donuts is the 11/4 track, pretty amazing track (from Glee)
some of the tracks of winnipeg is a frozen shithole make me LOL

/q

i don't seem to have it
which is strange, i could have swore i did
i meant winnipeg is a frozen shithole

oic

hmm
I think my cvar system deserves a rewrite

i'm listening to donuts now
have you heard hospitality?

nope

!!!

:O
is it good then?

of course

I've got 8 albums of his
he's so damn prolific, 16 albums

indeed
Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems
lame
looks like he's released another 2 albums since hospitality

its been like that for a while now.

madness

wh ois "he" btw?

yeah, a while as in years

venetian snares

one or two years I think…
I remember when it was openprojects instead of freenode.

aye, pink + green and my downfall

me too hehe
"opn"
i hardly irc at all now

I've been on freenode for two years now

i kicked the habit

6 years and going strong

IRC is too full of interesting people not to be on it

indeed

Aint dat da truthe

although sometimes I wish it were more consolidated

what does that mean?

I'm on 3 networks at the same time :/
because some people are there, others are here
etc.
if they could just all come to freenode…

now you're talking!
#ModernCalcs

hehe

i prefer to actually get stuff done :-/
which i have enough trouble with as it is
there are too many ways to procrastinate

and we learn more

well, you might use IRC to proctrastinate, but others may use it for entertainment/education/help

IRC is my eyes/ears to whats innovative and new

I usually hang out in the channel of the language I'm currently learning

it's mostly crap though
just trivial stuff
i mean there are better ways of being entertained
or educated
help it's good for

wikipedia

IRC/Skype/Gaim, what else is there?

i could read wikipedia for hours

books
films

RadSurfer, R/L?

here here
Left-brain,Right-brain?

speak for yourself

that's all i can do

Pennsylvania, U.S.A.
Earth. Sol.

hello
this works fine, but should i find another way to output an error? png_infop end_info_ptr; png_byte png_header[PNG_HEADER_SIZE];
err… sorry

aaaanyway
thanks for the help guys

http://rafb.net/p/yOe2Ex23.html

enjoy hospitality Cin

should i just use errx()?

tatty bye

you could return an int and use defines such as NO_SUCH_FILE and INVALID_IMAGE
or use an enum

oh, good idea
thanks

np

Okay so if I am working with MySQL inside of C and am having trouble with one of my functions, would I ask in here or in the mysql channel?

TheNo1Yeti, hard to say.

TheNo1Yeti, buddy be more verbose with your question. if yuo have some code, paste it and then ask the question. noones gonna answer the kinda question you just pitched

elizaWhy do you think, you have trouble in one of your functions?/eliza

anyone worked on a virtex-4 before ?

don't know if I should be asking this in #c or in #c++….can I create a library in C++ that I can use from a C program? Is it straight forward?

yep, i've done that in windows before, if you export objects the function names are going to be all mangled
and you need to worry about passing in a this ptr, etc.. etc..

yeah, well….basically, I have a small library right now that holds a static double dimension array and there are functions that are just nested for loops that go through searching for stuff. I wanted to use C++'s hash tables
The interface would still be the same, I'd pass in C Strings (character arrays)…..just the implementation of the library would be different

Are there any Cross-platform C++ GUI library that has native look 'n feel other than wxwidgets?
sorry… wrong channel… that would be on C++

Okay so http://rafb.net/p/S1Dj8y89.html is the relavent code and the output that gcc is giving me.
As far as I know I am using mysql_store_result & mysql_real_query properly.
And I am rtfm btw too.

there's insufficient information there to come to any diagnosis
at a very vague guess, you've incorrectly declared mysqlconn

http://rafb.net/p/HlwJnC34.html is the full function. And mysqlconn is just declared as MYSQL mysqlconn; in my mysql.h file

a google shows me that mysql_real_query requires a MYSQL * as the first argument

Hrm, it seems I was just outsmarted by an asterisk. I just redeclared mysqlconn as MYSQL *mysqlconn; and it compiled flawlessly.
Thanks.

well, it may compile, but that's not sufficient to make it work.
I suspect you are not up to speed on pointers.

Actually I just changed it around completely again.
I took a look at how I had originally done the basic db connection and found I had used mysql_real_connect(&mysqlconn……) and had mysqlconn declared as MYSQL mysqlconn;

That's more like it.

Yea, that's what I get for starting a project at 2am, getting halfway done and then deciding I would think better after sleeping
Regardless, I appreciate the help Quartus. Thanks

My console pong is slow.
Maybe I should try partial redraws.

Sure thing, TheNo1Yeti.

But that might make it worse because it takes forever to move the cursor around.

where can i get a coy of gnu c?
copy of gnu c?
I tried googling it

you could install a Linux distribution

i dont have linux

or FreeBSD or something

Really. You googled it.

get mingw

yes i found a site with quite a few gnu programs…but I can't seem to find it on the site

I was just saying that you could install linux

*very* first link google returns, choose Binaries under Downloads.
It's a pretty low hurdle to clear.

hi, how to determine the size of the file?

stat()

SamB…linux would be a listtle late now

i found a way, just i don't understand how it works
fseek(f, 0L, SEEK_END);
len = ftell(f);

that's not portable

neither is stat
you're moving to the end of the file and then you're getting the file position

puuh, someone know of an editor/ide for windows, which can highlight enabled/disabled code sections?

enables/disabled how?

I am running in circles…

if it is a text stream, the contents of the file do not necessarily translate to byte values and if it is a data stream, then you may have padding at the end of the file which would return an inaccurate value for your purposes

so i guess this method is faster?

Auris-: per preproc

i can't find a binary mirror site for gnu

kessel3, what? #ifdef FOOBAR ?

all i find is gnu files

duncwood, then I strongly suggest you give up; you will be unable to use it even if you find it.

Auris-: yeah, like this

No I have used it in the past..
I just have a new computer
its' incredible

If you really cannot find a working copy of gcc from that page, you have failed the IQ test.

??

kessel3, well, I don't know such things as I'm not even a windows user, but your ide would have to know compile time settings, which it could only do if it knew the compiler and project files.

I have found it..
now for installing it

Auris-: most (if not all) of the defines are in headers

kessel3, but the ide can't really be sure.

Auris-: except of some embedded extensions and register access its all plain C code
with lots of configuration #ifdef's

kessel3, you might know that, but can the ide reason it out?

actually we do not put defines on the compiler command options, so, if its parses the headers it should be fine

for your special case.
there's a reason why most static analysis software hooks into the actual build process–it needs to have all the information that is available at build time.
I suppose the IDE could list all defines that may affect compilation and ask the user what their values will be if it can't find them in the project's files.

btw what ides do you use for development with c?

emacs.
I don't like mousing around.

Auris-: or if one could define compiler specific defines as option if it doesnt know the compiler
slickedit or codewright a
ups, at work i wanted to add

well that was work
i got gnu c up and running

sometimes, i use sourcenavigator to see include dependencies

i should of never installed windows xp on this computer

did you get MinGW or what?

MinGW
just so I can use a stand alone program in Octave
gee

mmap is used in malloc, right? But does the stack have to be mmap'd by the process to?
*too?

dunno.

why would you care if malloc uses mmap? this is AFAIK depending on the platform anyway

If you wrote an app which just had "int i = 11;" as its only code in main, and compiled it for a Unix, would it run on windows? (Disregarding the different linker file formats)
x86 linux, to be sure

you mean could you link the .o file for both Linux and *nix?
er.
Linux and Windows
sorry

Yes, and executables too

you have to recompiler for linux/windows

Is there anything in the code which is compiled (not the file format) which is OS dependent? (If, of course, you don't call any OS dependent functions)

well, the .o file might work.
the ELF executable will NOT work on Windows, and you'd need WINE to run the PE…

I said disregarding the file format

that is something I cannot do

If you dropped the machine code from an ELF into a PE, would it run?

depends on a lot of thigns
probably not though

Like what things?

(assuming it's an executable…)
well, basically on how much information is left in the ELF and on how much ABI gunk has gotten involved…
and then there's those wierd underscores…

heh
What about the iBCS?

grab Quartus

grabbed Quartus.

hi guys, i need to create 2 programs, one for a windows box and one for a palm. Can i create a c program for palm?
anyone could tell me if i can compile a c program in a palm?

Probably, but you definitely can't use the same source for both
You could use Java, though. Then it would work on a number of mobile devices

I malloc three LPSTR variables. Fill two of them with RGB triplets from a webcam, then take the difference and assign it to the third. The third should be filled with low values since the first two are extremely similar. However, high-value "noise" randomly crops up - could it be that my data
is being overwritten by another program?

sure you could use the same source for both

does palm support java?

you just have to have pieces that are for just one or the other…
possibly libraries

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Application_binary_interface I suggest reading the last paragraphs

Palm supports Java

so i can compile c program in palm

Only if it didn't have a GUI!

cool

eh?

last question, how can i sync data from a program in a palm to a program in desktop for example? would i be easier in c or java?

what kind of palm program hasn't got a gui?

You can't use the same source code for both windows and palm os!

you certainly have to be creative

Ok. Thanks.

Zeiris, have your program detect those unwanted values and printout useful debug information.
Zeiris, and no other program can overwrite stuff in your program's memory area. (unless you have shared memory).

Aight. I've got the debug information, I just don't see any way to make it useful.

like printing the two original values are trying to see if they somehow lead to the weird value.
s/are/and/
maybe you are subtracting unsigned values and underflowing.

you have some code examples of that?
LPSTR .. is this some kind of char* ?

LPSTR seems to be a char* windows-style.
LPSTR diffLine, then I just use diffLine[i] to access bytes. First byte is 0.

char a.b; and you think this fits an RGB value?
a - b

It fits an R, G, or B value.

what is the range of an RGB value and what range does a char have?

RGB is three bytes, char is one byte? Three chars in a row make RGB.

wow you're smart

Is there something I'm missing here.

RGB is afaik 0..255, char depends on implementation, if char is signed, the -128..127, if unsigned 0..255

Chars can be signed? Ohshit.

yeah, same as plain short, int, long are signed too, unless you specify unsigned

Hm. No, I don't think that's it - assigning -1 to a line of chars results in a white line, which I assume means they overflow to -255.

the range is 0×80 … 0xff, 0×00, … 0×7f for signed char, and 0×00 … 0xff for unsigned, so if you write unsigned char c = -1; still is 255 (0xff)

How on earth do you know this?

because i struggle with that stuff a low of times
struggle is maybe not right, i have to do lots of this stuff

Okay, but if it was signed and I wrote c = -1, it would really -be- -1?
Still fairly sure it can't be that the chars are signed. Images captured off the webcam draw fine, it's when I mess with them that they turn weird.
What the! I just wrote everything to a text file and it looks like the bytes ARE signed!
And I take the absolute value before I draw stuff.. Crud.
Hm. So the way signed bytes are, you can use it as an unsigned all your life and never know. Evil.

yeah, unsigned 0xff (255) - 5 = 250, signed 0xff (-1) - 5 = -6

hi

Hey.

Just to secure my self-confidence, void main() is entirely incorrect according to ansi standards, right?

you're supposed to use double main()

hahah.

int main(int,char*[]) or int main(void)

/join #python

hi random
what happened to stormsrfr?
RadSurfer, are you stormsrfr?

no

whose stormsrfr?

__a guy who used to haunt this place

RadSurfer, where did u find references for doing that?

then he disappered as though he'd been free'd by some allocator

http://www.gnu.org/software/octave/doc/interpreter/Standalone-Programs.html#Standalone-Programs, warning: it's not necessarily as easy as it looks
I'm in Linux, so it wasn't too bad.

RadSurfer, me 2.. so what was the problem?

that..would..be..telling
c'mom, be brave it give it try on your own.

RadSurfer, yes.. of course

Just use your noodle, dude

RadSurfer, but, how about octave C api? where did u fiind references?

RadSurfer, so what does your stand=alone program do?

octave.org perhaps? use YOUR noodle dude
all your answers are on the posted url.
It proves that I can now link stand-alone Octave 2.9.13 applications.
if I use C++

RadSurfer, why dont u use scilab?

RadSurfer, que mal con c++

RadSurfer, it has a good manual, supports C, fortran, java, tcl…
RadSurfer, and it is opensource 2

I guess RadSurfer don't speak spanish, I just asked you what is wrong with c++ in your oppinion

I had SciLab 4.0…

RadSurfer, did u like it/
?

I can handle C++ (when I want too)
really didn't use it very much. SciLab 4 was the last Win98SE version, lol

RadSurfer, that's not saying much
anyway i wish you luck in doing something more interesting in the future

I wonder what the lastest Linux version is like? Hmm!

RadSurfer, i use scilab on linux and it works great, u can mix, scilab with a lot of programming languages.. may favorites: C and TCL

http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.6/testing/ChangeLog-2.6.23-rc3

scilab.org ?

kernel
i didnt understand

http://www.scilab.org/download/4.1.1/scilab-4.1.1.bin.linux-i686.tar.gz, is there an el5 specific version?

el5? sorry i didnt understand
RadSurfer

redhat enterprise version 5 (ie. CentOS 5)

RadSurfer, that file should work on ANY linux-i686 distro

I use SciLab a bit

Hodapp, great software, isnt it?

very handy.
don't know how to do much in it yet though

naturally.

so far it's just been plots of waveform data from a scope vs. theoretical formulas

I have Octave and Maxima installed. These have been fun lately.
so why not Scilab, round it off, lol

RadSurfer, maxima is great for symbolic computations.. but very very slow

I used to use Maxima a lot when I was taking Calc and DiffEq - it was glorious, it ran on my craptop with 24 MB RAM and almost no hard disk space

it's about functionality

maxima was never particularly lacking in speed for me

it does fine.

my friend likes Axiom as well but I have yet to try this one
I wish I had something that would run on my Mac though

i say that coz it toke on day to invert a big matrix (36×36) with many variables inside
one day
lol
symbolic computation is slow… it is a fact

you should probably define "slow" before you start using words like "fact".

actually there may be more preparatory work required.
Before using any words.

I rendered a frame once on my computer. It took 10 hours.

symbolic computation is SLOWER than numeric… got it now?

Rendering graphics is slow… it is a fact

frame? raytrace?

povray
probably

righto

povray is so nice
i love it

http://img244.imageshack.us/my.php?image=tempki8.jpg
that's one thing I rendered
in some software I wrote, just to test some of its functions and speed

scilab speaks of a gfortran bug. a lot of bugs have been corrected just recently

it looks like DISCO
RadSurfer, welcome to the world of opensource

hi all, I'm trying to compile coreutils under debian. I get this error :/usr/include/gconv.h:72: error: expected declaration specifiers or … before size_t. how do I fix it? thanks

RadSurfer, dont ask M$ about bugs.. they ll tell u there are just a few

they'll say "features" were "added"

Hodapp, nice point

lets say i have int a = 0;
and i want to do myfunc(&a);
if a has to be casted as a uint

yeah, it looks disco-like, because at the moment the interpreter only generates graphics internally and simple functions tend to look like that

how do you do to dont lose the & at its side ?
&(uint)a;
doesn't works

Fr3DBr, if you wish the & operator to yield a pointer to uint, you need to provide an object of type uint.

you cant cast and have the & of it ?

no, because casts yield values, not objects.

arg

you could cast your int* to unsigned* though

but the unsigned* pointer would be pointing to a signed value

and the signficant and much more important lack of understanding of casts would remain

hi all, I'm trying to compile coreutils under debian. I get this error :/usr/include/gconv.h:72: error: expected declaration specifiers or … before size_t. how do I fix it? thanks

looks like you're in the wrong channel

i think the major confusion with casting has to do with the lack of understanding when the compiler reinterprets, and when it does a conversion.

heh, I always wondered, what kind of error do you get if you auto int i; externally? (doesn't have a working compiler atm)

you really should ask this in #Debian

ok. sorry

like extern auto int i; ?

Yes, I suppose that would be conflicting types
correct?

gcc says multiple storage classes

thanks
also, what happens bitwise to a negative number again?

where you been? are you huggling now?

char 5 = 00000101b
char -5 = ~00000101b + 00000001b?

mostly rollign aorund on my flor
i need peopels to huggles or i get ssad
what' with the elading 0's?

;-) OK, answer me this question. i was browsing some of the photos on your website, and i want to know who the girl is. you sister maybe?

you know, apostrophe doesn't denote plurality, you can just write "0s"

Cin, don't harras orbitz. he is busy replying to e
;-)

vorpal ;D

..

where's your nickname originate?

char is 8 bits

an octet is 8 bits. a char may or may not be 8 bits on your platform, you realise this, yes?

a dream i had

maybe in yoru fictional world

can someone suggest where to look for source of c math library?

don't ignore me, brother
it will be part of your C library. in the case of glibc, you can get it from the GNU website

YaroslavVB3, there are many free software implementations of the math functions in C. glibc comes to mind.

whcih girl?i hav emanuy on there
' dnate plurarlity, ge toff yoru rocker

no

heh

yes. i went to school for english. what did you do, join teh swi team/ get out of m house

there is one in particular. slender blond, good looking.

that doesnt' narrow it down!

heh

I suppose you did go to an american school

hi Chris
you've been away for a while
what the hell?

well i sure as hell didnt' goto a school in China, they dont' even speak english there

I have?

yes

well, it was a while ago. let me see.. there is one photo of you and her with raised bottles of beer or whatever. another of you and her on a rooftop overlooking the city ( looks like NYC )

see, i didon' even ask a yes or no question, ge tou tofmy house

haven't you?

nah, I was here Friday

I'm just acknowledging you

oh alright

i guess it wasn't your sister

i don' know. i don't recall ever bein gon a roof

it's just another issue with american vs. british use of the english language

quit being such an uptight vagina face
and stop your bleating

I'm not being uptight
and I was just trying to help you out

what then? downtight? i sthat some new british slang? get ou tof my house

' dnate plurarlity, ge toff yoru rocker

my eyes are burning

yes, in America it is considered acceptable, apparently

you're drunk!
tell him he' sdrunK!

tell me who she is!

Could you pause, and read over what you type before you hit enter?
A drunk man, on irc.. definition of many.

find her!!
get otu of my house

OK, pm one sec

in before rape

why are ou sitll in my house?

why are you still talking to me?

cin, i 3 u

walshing matilda

I've miseed you

IRC sure makes for strange bedfellows, lol

i missed you too
you sohuld call mor eoften
sometimes i call boris
and i call him stupid
and hang up

hahahaha

oh orbitz.. you upset him

boriz hasn't been on here for aaages

i hope he's dead. last tim ei called he idn' tpick up and i was sad

oh I tried otu erlang recently, I remember saying it looked scary, after learning lisp it's more kcik-ass (for whatever reason)

erlang is the best langauge this side of mexico

mmm, concurrently eating chilli

I think I've heard better endorsements for toilet paper

it's hot sweaty and people like to make films out of it

huhuhu

bad films
erlang the movie was idrected by brett ratner
no wonder it sucked

it's brilliant
but it needs to be mashed up

it was brad pitt's last movie, before he died

of an ingrown toenail
wahc out kids
ingrown tonails can kill!
see your doctor today

D:

orbitzs' typing sure hasn't changed any

your mom

shit, I was in #politics and I started saying y'mam jokes for about an hour and they eventually thought I was some clever bot
retards

http://ortdotlove.net/~orbitz/rand0m.org/images/walmart/tesha/15-lrg.jpg

moar pooper
http://ortdotlove.net/~orbitz/rand0m.org/images/walmart/tesha/01-lrg.jpg

ah, http://zhivago.bugfix.co.kr/4.wmv

HOT

please don't shout.

##c, not /b/

ahh, thanks. I was wondering about that before

old cd-rom

192megabytes of pure unicycling mayhem

what's that
the wmv
ah right
my curiosity only stretches so far

in this day of divx, who still uses wmv's?

isn't wmv just another name for .avi

zhiv, your upload speed is so fast that you notice how slow your cd-rom is? or is that some _reallly_ old cd-rom?

and thus could easily contain divx encoded video

ick

Spark, I don't know if it can contain divx or not, but it is not the same as AVI.

hmm
what is it then

if WMVs are anything like WMAs, you get a very good size:quality ratio on the compression, better than OGG

besides, VC-1 is rather better than divx.

wmv isn't another name for avi
its more like another name for wma
I mean, if you're talking about file formats and not codecs
an older version of the WMV codec was quite similar to divx, from what I've heard…

what's xvid like in the scheme of thigns

I think it's a x2 or x1 speed

if i got the name right

wow

xvid is also rather like divx

Spark, it gives reasonable results for the relatively small amount of computation required to decode it.

it's an old notebook that I use as a terminal.

ah, I see. do you VNC/remote-desktop or just textual/console?
Wikipedia can tell you about Xvid, it can probably tell you about most any format, I think, which is nice

wikipedia is all well and good, but wht starts with xvid often ends several hours later with nuclear weapons technology

hehe

I usually end up at strange mathematics articles

I think it's pretty good if you want ab rief rundown and has some more detailed links/references at the bottom of the page if you're _really_ interested

Hmm, nukes

does Stage6 work on OS X?

I run X11 on it.

z, nice
zhivago, the "korean language word study" in the index page of that link you provided, is it yours?

well, as in I started writing something, and then stopped, yes.

zhivago, so are those pictures yours, too?

sure.

niiiice

that's where I live, mostly.

do you live near there?
wow

some of the ones at the end are from japan
(where I don't live)

heh, no

What's the difference between =+ and +=?

=+ is a forgotten legacy
and += isn't

=+ isn't an operator.

but it used to be

z, no wonder you like hiking

it looks a bit like bits of southern spain
the rock is different though

Centroid of a 1d array of integers would be sum_for_all_i(array[i]*i) / sum_for_all_i(array[i]) right?

is that a goat in the riverbed

there are two goats AFAIC

it is from a goat farm

ugh

the riverbeds are essentially collapsed lava tubes, so it's hard for goats to get out.
I'm not sure if it's legal, but he lets the goats run around down there.
they seem to get along well with ducks.

zhivago, lava tubes? as in, in case of a volcano erruption? P_p

ah
heh

in case of?

I live on a volcano.

Yes, they probably discuss the economy over tea.

What's the name of the volcano?

jeju.

yeah… to control the flow of the lava so the whole area isn't destroyed as much as it would be… like flood control

well, not exactly — they're more where rivers of molten lava flowed along
so when the lava ran out, they drained.

when did this last happen

because the tops were exposed to air, those usually froze first, leaving a hollow tube
later, with erosion, many of these collapse.

oh I see. cool

so it's not a natural river.. more of an opportunist river

Goats?

well, the rock is porous, so surface water gets in — the tubes tend to fill with sand, though.
once the surface erodes away, the sand is rapidly removed
then you get a water channel which tends to only visibly fill in flood-time — otherwise the water-flow tends to be subsurface.

why sand?

well, because of the porousity
are you familiar with pumice?

Pumice stone..

yeah it's a bit like a hard sponge isn't it
i don't know why it's like that though

it's full of bubbles.
the rock here is like various grades of that — you can pick up a rock the size of a small dog with one hand.
which is why most of the fences are made of stone.

it's formed from the gas-rich froth of glassy lava when it solidifies, or something.

heh
does it float
on water

no, because it's too dense.
it's a kind of graduation from pumice to solid basalt/granite.

breeze blocks do, i vaguely remember from my childhood, but they're artificial i'm fairly sure

most of the stuff is mid-way — so maybe 10-20% bubbles.

so the sand comes from these rocks?

well, I presume that it comes from the break-down of the finer bubbly rock, filtered through small cracks and passages in the ceilings of the tubes.

mm

if there is insufficient water flow to carry it away, then it accumulates — but this is not my area of expertise.

People use them as footscrubs, right?

yeah
pumice stones that is

z, still downloading the video, 50%

Right

I went down into one of the big tubes while it was raining — it was also raining inside the cave

what vid?

unicycling!

mountain unicycling.

ugh

Looks too easy. Should try juggling at the same time.

yay, the_plumber

heh, i was pretty drunk last night

heh cool

hope i didn't say things that pissed off people

is there a subterranean network of these things then

well, sometimes.
they are called mirodongul — labyrinth caves, but they are rare.
generally they are linear, possibly with multiple levels

i don't really remember

if the rate of flow decreases for a sufficient length of time a ceiling will form.

mirodongul, sounds like dongle?

if the rate of flow then increases suddenly, the flow can be on top of this ceiling, so you can get layers of tubes.

did you get into some beer too?

later erosion or melting can then cause vents to open to lower levels

heh that is cool

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=mirodongul&btnG=Search
not one reference to mirodongul

yeah, I need to take my camera next time I go.
you spelt it wrong

hows it spelt?

in hangeul

i missed the beginning, just connected

unfortunately your client is unlikely to speak euc-kr

emacs can handle anything?
actually, im using xchat

eMacs

¹7µ¿±¼, ¤»¤»

eeek, what is that?

that looks obscene

heh, no idea what that was

well, not quite everything, then.

could you send a screenshot of how it should look like?

just one moment.

use it

sometimes the threat of violence is enough

reminds me of the un-inspirational posters

http://zhivago.bugfix.co.kr/taneo/

"sometimes it takes a few angry men"

the first is with chinese characters, the second is with hangeul.

can you read this fluently?

which?

both

you cold learn sme strategy, my friend
s/cold/could/

well, for that word, yes.

Quick road cave?

flippo!

Ellen Degeneres isn't funny.

how is life in the rockies?

vorpal, Hotter than it should be.
vorpal, where are you again?

we've been blessed with another wetter than usual wet season. southern arizona here

"wandering" not "quick"

on the first look, the chinese letters look more angled

they are.

is that just coincidence?

So I can include a GPL program with a commercial program if the commercial program includes source?

only if "commercial" program is under gpl-compatible license

hmm

and GPL is commercial.

GPL-compatible requires that the program can be re-distributed by anyone for free, right?

GPL does not mean free to every body but to the customer. Let me know if I am mistaken.

I'm not good at interpreting legaleese
So I can license my program under the GPL and still require that the customer buy the program?
It's in perl so the source is included no matter what

What you would do is sell your customer *a copy* of the program, at whatever price you like.

If I sell someone a GPL-licensed copy of my program does that mean they are allowed to redistribute/sell it to anyone?

yes.

Yes, they are allowed to do that.

Looks like I'm gonna need to re-implement a bunch of code

Ola bbrazil

any CVS experts in the house? I'm stumped (but don't know too much).
OK… anyone awake?

"don't ask to ask, just ask the question already"

true that, ln… meanwhile I got my first answer from google, and you answered my second
have a great day bro

Whats's a decent CLI torrent client?

rTorrent

"Please send the following information, preferably GPG-signed." Wat do they mean with that?

www.gnupg.org

Hi! I'm developing a c cgi and want to embed a SMTP client to send data from a web form to a certain email. Is there any lib which could do it?

that's a good question mactimes

I just found libsmtp, btw. I'm reading and testing it. Let's see what comes out from it.
I'll let you know the results.

i'm back

mactimes, what else does your c web hosting with cgi support do?

User authentication for intranet access, user authentication for security cameras access and some other minor stuff

libsmtp

Thx

http://libsmtp.berlios.de/

mactimes, seemed you picked the winner lib. good luck with project!

Thx! I already downloaded it and I'm testing now
Thx! I looked for help on ##c previously, but ppl there aren't as friendly as I expected =/

;\

Hummm.
I'll try it first, but it already lacks smtp authentication required by my mailserver.
I think I'll make some changes and submit back to the author

you go girl, listen to you all open-source and stuff

esmtp?

Yup
Know any good lib?

esmtp, http://www.stafford.uklinux.net/libesmtp/

Thank, buddy! You're a life saver!

i know

Really! I've been looking for something like this for many days now.
I'm too dumb to implement one myself. =/

heh
the punchline is, i thought that libsmtp would be a good name for an smtp library
so i googled it
libesmtp"
so that's how i found that

Hummm. I thought all smtp libs would allow me to do what I wanted.
My mistake @_@

clear

Can I distribute GPL software and non-GPL software on the same CD?

yes

Ok
I wasn't sure if it was allowed since Linux distros can't include nvidia drivers

what license are the drivers available under?

Dunno, not distributing them
Some nvidia license I think

they prolly can and just choose not to as a distro/project policy not as an imposition place by the GPL
placed*

erm, probably nvidia won't let you distribute their binaries by any means

either way it's unlikely that it has anything to do with a restriction imposed by the GPL

sorry to ask again but do you know some p2p network that could carry phone calls just like the proprietary program that i'd rather not name does?

lindi-: ekiga?

… naming it is evil?

ekiga is a SIP client, afaik it does not do this
consider I'm in a LAN and i can connect to internet only via squid proxy

lindi-: what good is a p2p network without a userbase?

i'll create it

nVidia has nothing against distributing their drivers, they allow even repackaging them. The problem would be the license of fedora linux (and ethical issues).

nvidia's drivers are closed
the problem is them
not linux

even "nv" is quite questionable

I meant that Linux' license makes redistributing nVidia's drivers _legally_ questionable.

why?

the problem with nvidia/ati drivers is very simple
it's not legal to distribute the *binaries*, ever

You could argue that they are derived work of Linux, and thus violating GPLv2. But nVidia doesn't have anything against redistribution.

how come?

the binary is linked against the kernel, and thus a derived work

most distros have them on their mirrors

The binaries people distribute aren't linked against the kernel. The linking is done when the drivers are installed.

by GPL terms, it's only allowed to distribute derived works under GPL, including full source etc.
which is not possible with the proprietary drivers
that's not binaries
distributing the unliked drivers and leaving linking to the user is usually considered OK
(though some believe that even the unlinked drivers are a derived work and thus illegal… that's a grey area)

That's on grey area. I have been told that if I design an application to use GPL'd library, my app must be under GPL *even if* I distribute only the source code of the app.

sometimes
i just wish GPL never existed
and we all used BSD
i hate thinking about this crap
this is for lawyers

lindi-: Not to depress you, but personally I probably wouldn't use a P2P phone system even if it were on open protocol and with free software. I don't want other people to use my bandwidth for their phone calls.
I guess we all hope so, but very many people think that GPL is more practical (now ignoring philosophy and ethics) than BSD license.

depends on the interface. and yes, it is a grey area, as I said

i am well aware of that

well, ideally copyleft would be protected by law, and we wouldn't need special licenses at all

but my main priority is free software, a technically inferior solution is ok
when people ask me to install the proprietary program i say "no thanks" because it's proprietary and not because it is not technically elegant

lindi-: I understand your goal too. Personally I'd like to solve the issue with something like IPv6, but maybe it's too unrealistic.

ideally
we wouldn't need laws
because people would respect each other

simple nat hole punching voip client was easy to write in python in a day
now i'm wondering if i really need to write prototype the p2p parts too or if there are some existing parts

lindi-: Does NAT-UDP hole punching fail too much to be useful in 95% of cases? I'm afraid so, because some companies really do it with P2P, but still…

google talk claims they only get 8% of people to use the relays
so some p2p could easily help those out

lindi-: With proprietary software it is easy to force everyone to be P2P servers (that is, those who help other boxes). But with free software, people would be able to turn off the P2P part, making it less useful.

sure

You can nowadays tunnel IPv6 behind pretty strict NATs and firewalls, but it certainly needs a lot more effort to setup than NAT-punching phone app.

but ipv6 traffic would then use some tunnel broker?
who would want all the phone traffic to go through his tunnel broker?

lindi-: Yes. Tunnel broker is like a second ISP. If you have public IPv4 address, you can use anycast tunnel, which requires no registration, just a few commands to start using it. Anycast tunnel doesn't go behind NAT though, and that requires using e.g. a separate tunneling service and
tunneling app.
lindi-: It's different thing to use tunnel broker than P2P: You are wasting tunnel broker's bandwidth, which is fine (otherwise the tunnel broker wouldn't have set up such service). With P2P, you are using Bandwidth host of regular home
users.

but this won't help if you are in a LAN, and the only way out is web proxy
could the tunnel broker be so kind and run openvpn on port 443?
maybe i could use the tor network

lindi-: That's a hard situation, but I wonder how P2P would go through that either? You need to tunnel it on top of HTTP, which gets ugly.

no need to talk http
433 is for https, proxies will let you send anything
and this is what the proprietary app does

lindi-: If you have Squid as a transparent proxy, non-HTTP traffic doesn't go through. I cannot play MMS streams unless I turn of the transparent proxying.
Oh, didn't think HTTPS, right.
I don't know any tunnel broker that would do tunneling over TCP. SixXS supports it over UDP.

also i don't understand where they get the money for that
so, tor has some routers that listen on 443

Thinking about casual users, installing tor is too big requirement.

this must be automatic of course

Might work then

not sure about the latency

I have never used tor, and I was just going to say the same about latency.
Using one intermediate server to route the call is fine, but tor may use several.

it seems the client can choose the path
i need to find a way to compress the audio to exreme minimum
otherwise there is no chance to use tor

From Ekiga's config, Speex can go 8 kbit/s and iLBC 13.3 kbit/s.
Am I alone, or do SIP and H.323 sound pretty complex things to achieve voice communication between two computers? Both need multiple open ports and so on. I wonder if it could be done simpler (and thus make it easier to trust that they are secure).

telecom, standards
i thought 8kbit/s was the input
and output bandwidth was variable

Uncompressed 8-bit 8 kHz PCM takes 64 kbit/s. I suppose those codecs take that as their input, and compress to the bitrate displayed in "Bandwidth" column in Ekiga.

yes
any idea how well it compresses?

I had an impression (but actually I have no real clue) that the codec would always output with the promised bitrate, and decrease quality when needed.
Highly variable bitrate would be problematic for QoS to reserve bandwidth for each call.
Or what did you mean?

i had the impression that both fixed and variable output rate was supported

IMO, fixed bitrate sounds like a good choice for VoIP.

i'll test how voice goes over tor..

Jabber-like approach could also be acceptable, at least in the beginning: big organizations would run their own VoIP server, and that would route the calls when no direct connection can be made.

tor does not seem to be too nice for uncompressed voice

tor? A new format?

The Onion Router ?

yep

what's the difference between GPL and LGPL?

google

here's the links http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/lesser.html and http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl.html

thanks but i cannot afford reading both
just to find out the difference
isn't there a brief text on just the differences?

Try wikipedia
it summarizes each one
check their articles
Did you find what you needed to know

yes thanks, reading atm

Ok

where can i outsource and develop a vga-usb client to lan to vga-usb host device?

If a proprietary application can link to an LGPL library without releasing the source…
….then what's the big difference between LGPL and BSD-style?

lymeca, Under LGPL, if you make a derived work of the library, then you have to grant all the freedoms.

ah okay, so LGPL is still copyleft, just not for library links?

err yes, if I understand what you're saying right.

So if I took a copy of OpenOffice.org (LGPL v2.1) and modified it, the copyleft still applies and I must release my changes?

No. There's never any obligation to distribute modifications.
But if you choose to, then you must follow certain conditions.

but
Ah okay I understand that bit
Let me rephrase my question to be more technically accurate:
So if I took a copy of OpenOffice.org (LGPL v2.1) and modified it, then distribute the resulting project, must my modifications also be released under the LGPL?

Either the LGPL or the GPL.

So LGPL works the same way as the GPL for distributors, except when it comes to library linking?
Why would a project such as OpenOffice.org choose the LGPL over the GPL then?

The answer to the first question is (basically) "yes".
The answer to the second is something you'd have to ask the OpenOffice people.

Say I'm making a proprietary application (wouldn't happen and I want to link an LGPL library to it. I can do this, but if I distribute the resulting product I must also provide source code for the library, correct?

Or provide a written offer to do so, yes.

if I modify the LGPLed library, compile my proprietary application against it, and distribute the result, do I have to release my modifications of the library under the terms of the LGPL?
(obviously my application can remain proprietary, but what about modifications of the LGPL library?)

You can opt to distribute them either under the GPL or the LGPL.
See section 3.

But I cannot make my modifications of the LGPL library proprietary…
That's what's important

No.

So that's why LGPL is weak copyleft
aaahhhh
Thanks jmd =]

np.

I'm working on a website for a GLUG at my college.
I'm very clear on GPL vs. BSD licensing issues, but not GPL vs. LGPL
I should finish it up so I can upload it and past the URL here asking for comments/suggestions

This page might help you to understand http://www.gnu.org/licenses/why-not-lgpl.html

Hello everyone

hi Gadien

lkundrak are you new user?
so, does anyone here have experience with windows?
Who here is new?

no way! )
There is a channel about ##windows here, or it is just troolling? )

actually, i have a windows related question what is the easiest way for me to build windows binaries of some program without having to use windows myself?

what? my name not what you think it is or something

lindi-: I found some Live CD edition, so it won't damage your HD )

haha, i'm here for the same reason you are lindi

for compiling?

No, to run it, with applications and a lot of cooool warez! )

but i don't want to run it

You can try using MingW so…

that should work from debian?
"Freedom through obsolescence. Those who still really need to can now build windows executables from the comfort of Debian."
says the package description

does anyone know which channel to visit if i wanted to speak to new programmers?

uuum, I think it works with Debian
try joining ##language_name_here
##c, ##perl, ##asm

thankyou verry very much tvtoon

no pro )

so, what's with the extra hash?

Which hash? )

)

##c
for example

Read the Network FAQ to discover that "##" means second party channel )
And "#", first party, A.K.A. creators… )
Pretty interesting, uh? )

OKay so what's the deal
Is PDF a Free format or not?
Most of what I've read says it is.

lymeca, 50 bucks and a answer, here is your deal )

But how come there are no roubst Free Software PDF editing solutions?

depends on what you mean by robust

Adobe Acrobat style.

what does that do?

I mean if the format is totally documented and there are no patent issues surrounding the format.
lindi-, you're answering questions about PDF without knowing what Acrobat is?
No offense, but that's a little odd.

i know what it is but i have not used it for a long time
i just read the pdf specification two weeks ago

He / She / It probably means cool GUI with rainbow wallpaper )

tvtoon, the thid option, definitely.
Definitely 'It'.
Definitely.

and this time it was about some multiple master font rendering not being supported right by xpdf

A RAWBOT )

But xpdf is just a reader…

yep, i still don't feel like pdf would be really editable :/

And yes I do mean a cool GUI and no I don't mean with rainbow wallpaper.

But rainbow is nice!

I mean look at OpenOffice.org: it can read and write to all formats sure, but it can't edit PDFs when it can edit all the other formats!

but it's not so simple

Of all the formats OpenOffice.org has, it can even edit proprietary binary-only Microsoft Office formats, but not a supposedly open one?
lindi-, I have *not* read the PDF specification, not two weeks ago, not ever.

if your pdf file has letters "a" "b" and "c" in some coordinates how does the program know whether they are on the same line or not?

So I fully admit I'm not up to speed on the technological implementation of the format to say the least.

this problem might of course be partly because many program create pdf that is difficult to edit

theoretically, you can always use TeX, but it is so alien-like, better not bother with )

I've pondered learning TeX
I've read many comments on Slashdot moderated up sky high by ozzing endless praise for TeX.
That makes me want to learn it, and I don't know if that's bad or not.

http://iki.fi/lindi/pstosvg extracts text from postscript and creates svg that might be editable
so if you first convert pdf to ps you'll see the problems

I think it's good… Slashdot usually leads me to the write place, like GNU+Linux and whatnot.

haha, and for vi, and for jed, and for elvis )

got some specific pdf in mind?

No.

for the sake of argument, pick one

Just seems to me that if a company produces a proprietary software product that supposedly can read/write/fully edit files in a format that they made and released as an open spec, it should be fishy if no alternatives exist for that proprietary product simply on the editing front.

sure it is fishy

thankyou again

If it's an open spec, someone should be able to write an editor for the format, and we shouldn't have to rely on a proprietary application made by the company.
I'd be fool to think there's *not* something wrong with this scenario.

there is a gnu pdf project starting

one time is enough, you may insult some angry people, you know )
like, I am not stupid and blahblah

The first thing I could think of was that there was funny things going on with the format not being 100% Free from patents or licensing restrictions.
How about you answer this question:
Are there, to any of your knowledge, any patent or licensing issues with the PDF format?

my bad

surely many i'd guess

Gadien, let me repay the thanks so we can equilibrate this situation, thanks )

okay….
so…..
how is it a Free Format?
There aren't any problems with OpenDocument

how said it was a free format?

A lot of things I've read

read http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/pdf-devel/2007-08/msg00000.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDFedit
whoa

PDF is free as in frisbee )

ompaul, gday
tvtoon, frisbee?

Yeah, you throw away, it keeps going )
So free…

g'day Kamping_Kaiser

ompaul,
been a while.
5 weeks to be exact

what is the proper way to add copyright notices to a modified work?

put your own copyright notice underneath the existing one

ok - and if you are releasing it under a dicfferent license (say, original work was BSD, modified work is GPL)
how do you handle that?
because their protions are still BSD - but yours are not

just put your copyright notice in the source, referencing the license, and usually put a copy of the license in COPYING

The only free code is in the public domain, lokkju_wrk.

Olgem, um, ok…
I was just curious about the proper ettiquite - I know I had to include it somewhere, but wasn't quite sure how to handle both licenses

Olgem, for certain values of free

so long as the existing notices are maintained, I think you're ok

GPL", do you think I could fork it under GPL3 without any license problems?
it's no longer maintained since 20050307

if they don't specify a version you can; but that's not really much of a license statement to go on :/

there's no COPYING nor anything else
and each file has only copyright notice in it, completly nothing about license

eek.

only README mentions that it's GPL

Could you contact the original authors?

no, there's only their jabberid in README, which are no longer valid

good grief.
tbh, you could probably do what you want and it would be ok
however, it would be a bit dodgy officially

what does 'dodgy' mean?

it wouldn't be completely clear whether or not the software is properly licensed

I want to fork it just because it became working oddly with new gtk+

yeah, I can understand that

oh, one of source files have "either version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.", so I can change it to 3, right?

yeah; the problem isn't the license - it's showing that all the software is under the license

Hi, I just removed the login form from my theme, but now I am unable to login to my site (to admin), I already tried site.com/login & site.com/?q=login but none of these work, is there any way to login?

?q=user

ok, thanks!

hey, I'm writing a small module that depends on a CCK content type
can anyone help me write a function in .install to "create" that content type?
is there some handbook somewhere?

is it normal that only user login block displays when I add it on the left sidebar, but if I remove user login and add others to the left sidebar they just do not appear to anonymous users :s
(I configured them so they should be visible, so none of the roles clicked)

I'd try to help you but I've a number of conference calls lined up

in the cck module page nop ?
(in order to have the INSERT query)

hi

nvm, got it

hi

we have #drupal-book for the book discussion , i hope pwolanin shows up soon

I'll wait if it's fine by you
nope, I want a .install file to do it

http://drupal.org/node/51220 (first result on google with .install file drupal … )

2 IRC mentions

you dont search for a long time …

hello, i upgraded d4.6 to d5.1 and i had a load of spam comments… it was just some old blog stuff and i didnt really care bout the comments so i deleted them all…
but now in teaser view it says "5 comments"
and you click it, and there is no comments…
the full view looks fine
anyone know where that info is cached ?

node_comment_statistics

can i just truncate that table ?
or would that be a bad idea (tm)

update node_comment_statistics s set s.comment_count = (select count(*) from comments c where c.nid = s.nid and c.status = 1);

if you truncate it , then a lot of things will get broken

or something ?

sounds like an idea.

thanks UnConeD
will try that or something

since your table is already messed up, it won't do more damage

seems to have worked, thanks!

can anyone help me in the binary poll?

yay - i am now D5 compliant

you're probably right
I prefer asking on IRC over searching on Google

you should look for on google then ask what you dont understand by yourself
you gonna be powerfull :p

the problem is you didn't get what I meant at all
I've written a good number of .install for both 4.7.x and 5.x

you want create acck view when enable your module

I'm asking about creating CCK content types via APIs not UI
yes
and the page you sent has nothing about that

heya — long time!

creating CCK content types –insert a row in the correct table …

i'm staying up late cos of soc

wrong
creating a CCK type means calling APIs

mentoring your students or writing the intermediate student reports?

so drupal_execute ?

execute what?
I don't think you get it at all

the form who create a ckk content

thanks for attempting to help
Dries_:
you still willing to help?

probably not, i never use CKK

then why bother yourself?

because your probleme looks like a little one

There is no real API for this at the moment, IIRC. drupal_execute is a way that should work.
bThere is no real api hosting for this at the moment, IIRC. drupal_execute is a way that should work./b

^^

thanks, no but thanks
OK

so drupal_execute ?

nope

^^

once again
thanks

lol
good luck …

ooh, the bot.module is mentioned in the latest lullabot podcast
(yay eaton, walkah, et. al.)

it's awesometastic.

heya

what is? the latest popcast? or drush?

bot.module

ah. thanks

I'm actually hunting now for a place to host one of my sites that would allow me to run bot.module just because it's so cool. and that site has a dedicated irc channel for members.

rackmounted.com allows it, but it's full dedicated servers, not VPS.

how is the book coming along?
make sure to upgrade The module

it's pretty early but it's coming. We're targeting Drupal 6, which is tricky because it's focusing on how to build complete sites with core and contrib modules…

understandable

Our plan is to build them in 5, then update for 6 as we approach the deadline. And… update any modules ourselves if they aren't already
heheh

I'm sure there are a lot of things you can sort of "prepare" already

_4str1:

user_admin_access_add?

http://api.drupal.org/api/5/function/user_admin_access_add

just to clarify things

look at the first line of the function
ah.
i see.
nevermind.

your solution was useless for me since i'm using 4.7.x

ok

??

sad news!

are you teasing or something?

what's up?

Your toshiba post has dropped to number 2 on a google search.

hmmm

http://www.google.ca/search?q=toshiba+r500&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

4.7 haven't drupal_execute fuction ?

well as i search it's 3rd

still showing how Drupal's SEO kicks ass and takes names, though.

it's still quite serious

it's six hits above Toshiba's store selling 'em.

how can i place the binary poll in my page

oooh boy, the stuff i end up at page 1 at google… even free pron at some time

oh, yeah, you lurkers in the channel, throw a few bucks at chx, yes?
http://www.drupal4hu.com/node/47

no, i'm not teasing

thx.

then why the ""

what? no white overpriced hardware for you?

the price matters less than the weight
bertboerland and if I will have the time I will experiment with making a hackint0sh out of one of the notebooks

Hmm… Yet another CMS contest… http://drupal.org/node/159731

1 IRC mention

Seems like there's a lot of those.

Michell_ there will be a f/p story soon

I was wondering if there would be

I made a hook_menu who create some items ( with !$may_cache) with a type of menu_callback what is the best way to get them for construct a menu to put in a block ?

http://drupal.org/user/128428

Blocked, thanks

I've looked around every couple of days since we did that massive spammer cleanup, but haven't spotted anything.

Cool, thanks. I haven't had much comptuer time so I havent' looked

Actually - http://drupal.org/profile/interest/loan

How about the list on drupalforevil?
At least the first one is still active… http://drupal.org/user/134308
http://groups.drupal.org/node/5051

3 IRC mentions

Some of those don't look like spammers…

All the ones *I* put on there were
heh

Josh is crying… I gotta go, sorry

You sure? most don't even have a url listed…

Too bad they got mixed in with the others :-/
bulk Bot registrations
I saw a lot with country set to Hungary and keywords set up
err
keywords as user name
"Adult sex video", "free porn video", etc
But not logged in

You're probably right, they just aren't as blatant - no url or keywords.

http://drupal.org/user/130350 http://drupal.org/user/110429 http://drupal.org/user/135493 http://drupal.org/user/109777
Those ones aren't blocked yeyt

user blocked

I'm having a problem with the admin area in firefox, every time you click on a link, it jumps to the right (with layout anomalies) and then you need to click again to get the link, has anyone else experienced this?

userS blocked

http://drupal.org/profile/interest/loan

http://drupal.org/user/135552 http://drupal.org/user/135441
heh

okay, many tabs open. blocking in progress

http://drupal.org/user/124328 http://drupal.org/user/117385 http://drupal.org/user/125600 http://drupal.org/user/134329 http://drupal.org/user/110199
Yeah
I wrote a greasemonkey script to show blocked status in user search results when we were having that blocking marathon

With the hlp of Michelle we did a mass purge about a week ago that blocked about 100+ users.
*help

we should block hungary

Nah, just look for users with spaces in username from hungary
that registered between 30 and 20 weeks ago
Who have never logged in

are you trying to provoke chx?

yes

if you block Hungary I will proxy

awww

and

kick my ass

from August 1 - 31 i will be in Germany

heh

Profile country

then until Sep 30 I will be in Barcelona

just change your profile to Canada ASAP

++

whoo, barcelona!

and if I still I do not have a PR visa to Canada

Somebody's stupid user registration script was using Hungary as country field……

then I will pick more countries/cities

I just have to convince my company to cover my airfare somehow.

paint Druplicons and sell them on the 'Con.

when having multiple tabs open i sometimes have a "validation error" when editing users…
known bug?

I haven't worked at this job long enough to get vacation time - but it'd be nice.
I've had a lot of good feedback on http://squidgystudios.com/drupal/drupa_social_networks.jpg , so I'm thinking of retooling that as a shirt very shortly.

http://drupal.org/profile/interest/loan clean

saw your email re: the DB system's return values.

dude
Carrying a sword to the beach….
Rock on

I think there is an issue already on that. I particularly remember tackling this. but i am happy to tackle again.

hey, a man should never be without a weapon of some kind.

ok, though would it hurt to add a check in the menu code for !isset?

hi folks, probably a stupid question.. but how does one re-enable a drupal web host 4 site that they've put into off-line mode ?

You should have seen "free" - I think it we blocked half a dozen pages of them!

never fix the result fix the cause

First of all, ask in the SUPPORT channel

just log in as admin, from yoursite.com/user/ and you're good to go

i think one of next year's soc project should be a vast improved anti spam filter webmail host filter

sure, I agree - but we're looking at the return from load functions, which are module-defined not core

support?

Please throw a quarter in the support jar (http://association.drupal.org/donations) . #drupal is reserved for development discussions (please see channel topic). Volunteers offering live support can be found in #drupal-support. If no one is available in #drupal-support, try the forums at http://drupal.org/forum. Thank you for giving us a space to work on improving Drupal for you!

thank you Squidster, but i get a 404 on that. sorry for posting my question in the wrong spot.

anyhow, if you think you can get the core DB functions fixed soon, I'm happy to leave the menu code alone

index.php?q=user is the "should always work" url.

98988

Drupal, database system, normal, closed, 1 IRC mention

looking at that issue - this was fixed already?

y

is it possible to remove the "read more" for a front-page 'page', so the complete page gets displayed?

so which funtions you have a problem with ?

ahh, that's only for db_result, not db_fetch_array and db_fetch_object, which are the problem here.
compare - http://us.php.net/manual/en/function.mysqli-fetch-array.php
to http://us.php.net/manual/en/function.mysql-fetch-array.php
the return values is NULL vs. FALSE

Another win for consistency in PHP …. NOT.

the smae for fetch_object
the pg functions return FALSE:
http://us.php.net/manual/en/function.pg-fetch-object.php

then mysqli needs a patch

You know what I wish we had? db_fetch_column($result,$col) that would make single-column multiple-row queries simpler in code…

yes, probably also a comment in doxygen for all, so anyone doing a port will know that the return should be FALSE

instead of return mysqli_fetch_array($result, MYSQLI_ASSOC);
we need
$return = mysqli_fetch_array($result, MYSQLI_ASSOC);
return isset($return) ? $return : FALSE;
that's not a biggie.

yes, not a biggie at all

same for object.
but fucking annoying.

yes. Also odd that no one has noticed it.
http://us2.php.net/manual/en/function.sqlite-fetch-array.php

Does mysqli REALLY return null, or is everyone just trusting the documentation here?

the contact module split patch broke on php hosting 5.2, but worked on 4.4 until I accounted for this difference

Ahh

that was very aggravating - it worked for me, but Crell and someone else were posting back on the issue that it didn't work…
just reconfirmed with var_dump- mysql: bool(false), mysqli: NULL

hi, i made several items in a hook_menu (they are typed MENU_CALLBACK) i'm making a block who supposed to print the menu generate by those items

sure.
see http://cvs.php.net/viewvc.cgi/php-src/ext/mysqli/mysqli.c?revision=1.106&view=markup
if (!(row = mysql_fetch_row(result))) {
RETURN_NULL();
}

what's a zval?

is it possible to jiggle fivestar.module to allow a different image for each star?

it's all done via CSS; if you tweak the theme function to finesse the classes and/or IDs that are output you could redo the CSS to use different images for each of the stars?

d.o. = down?

what should i use for html render the menu ?

http://pastebin.ca/621918 this is a zval in PHP4
php5 i do not have at hand.

thånks

d.o in trouble?

seen dww

dww was last seen in #drupal 3 days 16 hours ago saying 'gotta run, later folks.'.

that's the C code, I think

meh! that's the php C source

ah

a ZVAL is the C structure representing a PHP variable.

ok, wow!

loks look every star just has the class 'star' plus 'on' if applicable

The Z is for Zend Engine and the VAL is for Value, IIRC

so does the paste above convicne you that if there is nothign to fetch you'll get a NULL ?

drupal site offline

works like a charm here

I was convinced after pwolanin confirmed

not offline, just s..l..o..w…

now it works here

ping

that's nothing

yeah maybe its slow

pong

php code is never a confirmation it can be a coincide , version dependent , anything
the only thing that determines in a case like this is C

how hard it is to make a pie chart with drawing api?

do not mention
do not mention pie
I am hungry

see http://ejohn.org/

and lunch is at least an hour away

what should i see here?

the pie chart
how hard/possible is that with drawingapi?

i guess i have to enable js for this
well right now its possible, but you have to calculate the circle elements in bezier

Gotta love how the function is void php_mysqli_fetch_into_hash in mysqli and static void php_mysql_fetch_hash in mysql….
Gotta love how the function is void php_mysqli_fetch_into_hash in mysqli and static hosting void php_mysql_fetch_hash in mysql….

makes a cool tag cloud, huh?

i personally hate tag cloud

:o

this way of representing information is not very useful to me
but pie chart will be possible, im planning to implement it

col

right now it is theoretically possible. but due to the complex description of path i have to find a mathematical way to describe it
i haven't yet looked into it
but was planning to do it this week
gh so much js on this website, its annoying

well you have one more taker

thats inspiring!

My memories are sketchy but a circle is not a bezier function

but a slice is

but you can approximate it to very close accuracy with a cubic bez

a circle is easy, but i need slices.

up early or late ?

long story
late

or 24hr cycles do not bother you.

but tonight can be summarized as
"if you slack off on soc, unconed will call your parents"

no kidding

nah, i needed to make sure the student read the mail before the google deadline

hi all. did we have the book patch IRC session yesterday?

you really called a student's parents? blimey!
no. we have one now. #drupal-book

i couldn't find his phone number
well rather, he lives at home
anyway, can't say that drupal doesn't look after its students

there was a 'lost' student webchick reported is this the one?

no, this guy is not yet lost
but was dangling

which one?

one of the themers
but we gave him the benefit of doubt

we should have a second SOC roundup session over at the d.dojo - I think people got something out of webchick's earlier session.

Squidster++

er, thanks.

http://drupal.org/node/159748

Drupal, web hosting with database services system, normal, active, 1 IRC mention

down

down?

Yes, it's possible that drupal.org is down, but be assured that Druplicon is fighting to get it back online!

when having multiple tabs open i sometimes have a "validation error" when editing users… — I've hit that too

patch uploaded

anyone know if it is possible to programatically submit the cck import form?

well, we hit our new maxclients settings in apache now (200). This week I should be able to get the third node up
monday mornings are always hard on the site it seems

drupal_execute, I believe
drupal_execute?

yeah
i did htat

yeah but for the content_copy_import_form there are two fields, the first is the 'type_name' and the second is the 'macro'… the macro is php code

let me find.

i am also trying to do this during a _profile_final() call if that helps
i can pastebin what I have if you want to see it

this script ported our content types from dev to prod http://pastebin.ca/621963

what is __file_upload__?

heredoc syntax

later all

I'm still seeing that " 'menus' not being set as a parent on a clean install" issue… I wonder if that mysqli bug you were discussing earlier (or similiar) could be the cause?

there are certainly going to be some issues in the menu code from that. I'm not sure

ping

hunmonk, pong

you still interested in improving the drupalorg_testing profile?

hunmonk, oh yeah, patches would be great
hunmonk, you want commit on it?
i got a copy of the db dump so it's been a lower priority for me… but i should be able to verify that stuff matches

i can add myself for commit access, which i will shortly
but there are some related patches in other modules which need to go in before i start w/ that profile
if you have time to review them, that would be great

hunmonk, of course.

hello all. anyone here make/contribute to autocomplete.js?

cool!

or anyone know how to do the equivalent of trim() in js?

OMG Heine may have found the bug that makes IE7 unable to edit Views sometimes. Or at least he found a clue that may lead us to that!

whoo!
heine++

:o

Of course, the answer may be FCKEditor + collapse.js + IE7 have some bizarre interaction issue
bOf course, the answer may be FCKEditor + collapse.js + IE7 have some bizarre interaction issue/b

http://drupal.org/node/159533 — that one is the most important

autocomplete bugs out on ' ' as a string

Devel, Code, normal, patch (code needs review), 3 IRC mentions

jakeg, yeah i seem to remember ie being really bad about that

know the js to trim?
or the jquery

http://drupal.org/node/159419 — this one would also be nice, as the profile currently bombs in postgres w/o it

CVS integration, Code, normal, patch (code needs review), 1 IRC mention

http://drupal.org/node/159645

1 IRC mention

Oh that's refreshing, since I've been fighting idiots in the queue lately.

yeah, it's nice to see a little appreciation now and then.
If it helps any, when I demonstrated Views to my homies at the office, they were one and all blown away by the dream of never writing an SQL query again.

hunmonk, just reviewed the 1st one. as per the new everyone gets strict reviews, it needs some formatting love.

Hah. That's a dream; never is definitely too much

er. where?

Heh, my hubby is just the opposite. He didn't see the point when he could write the queries himself. LOL

well if the query would join the node table, yeah 100%. newbies always seem to think views can build any arbitrary query

I flipflop between both viewpoints - if it's something that needs to be intensively themed or only wants one field of a node, I'll write it myself, but if it's something where it needs to node_load, Views is easier to maintain.

hunmonk, where what?
hunmonk, http://drupal.org/node/159533

Devel, Code, normal, patch (code needs review), 4 IRC mentions

i'll have those fixed in about 5min. they are all leftovers from the code that was already in there

there are a lotta tabs in there

merlinofchaos, did I overhear you say something about being able to join to other tables besides node? or did I dream that?

At the end of the day the best host answer is upgradeability. A view isn't custom code.
That's in the plan for Views 2.

hunmonk, sounds good. i'm no longer offering or accepting that's the way the code already was an excuse for not fixing comments or formmatting in patches.
as an excuse

sure, that's fine

merlinofchaos - Well, he doesn't actually use Drupal. He uses php Fusion. But he does so much custom stuff I wonder why he bothers with a CMS. When I mentioned I would do X with a view in Drupal he thought that was silly relying on someone else to keep things updated when he could write the query himself and keep it updated himself. He just doesn't get it. LOL

Michelle, sounds like a variant of NiH syndrome

NiH?

not invented here

Ah

ty
drupal cures that real quick

That's ok. He can continue his thing.

He tried Drupal once but didn't like it. TBH, I didn't really push it… If he starts using Drupal then I become tech support. LOL

http://drupal.org/node/159533#comment-275480 — that should be more to your liking

Devel, Code, normal, patch (code needs review), 5 IRC mentions

i wish we spent half as much time on quality testing of patches as we do on quality coding style

did you run that script as part of the install profile, or just separately?

i can't tell you how many times a db update patch hasn't even worked on postgres

hunmonk, it's just one of thoe obvious things. i'm not even going to bother applying a patch that has coding standards violations because it shows they didn't pay attention to detail.

yes, i understand. i just think it's odd that code can look perfect and get in, but break shit all over the place

hunmonk, oh totally, i hope the new schema stuff will fix that.

the $form_state reordering was a perfect example of that. there have been at least a dozen patches to fix stuff that was broken by that patch
it probably should have been tested more carefully

hunmonk, yeah but the problem with those huge patches that touch every file is that it's almost impossible to test every part, especially when other stuff is broken in head. you almost have to commit it half way and then track down the rest

nah, it's not that hard. two Drupal services installs, one before patch, one after patch. if it works before patch, and not after patch, patch has a problem

hunmonk, does pgsql support truncate/
?

it actually would have been easy to find those _if_ somebody had taken the time to test the forms
http://www.postgresql.org/docs/7.4/interactive/sql-truncate.html

hunmonk, as a huge unit test fan i can't really fault people for not testing every single form
hunmonk, would that be better than using DELETE {foo}? i know on mysql it's faster

but think about the time aspect of it. how long do you think it would have taken for somebody to test all drupal forms? compare that to all the time we've collective spent fixing what was broken by the patch

hunmonk, i agree, it should have been tested.

Compatibility, There is no TRUNCATE command in the SQL standard.
i personally don't think we should use truncate

hunmonk, sounds good.

truncate is an alias isn't it?

not in mysql. pretty sure it just unlink()s the db file and recreates. very fast.

given that we're shooting for more databases to be compat, we should avoid it

support?

Please throw a quarter in the support jar (http://association.drupal.org/donations) . #drupal is reserved for development discussions (please see channel topic). Volunteers offering live support can be found in #drupal-support. If no one is available in #drupal-support, try the forums at http://drupal.org/forum. Thank you for giving us a space to work on improving Drupal for you!

lol was that easier than just doin' /join #drupal-support? ;P
is it just me or is the description field in .info files overly sensitive to punctuation chars? exclamation and parentheses seem to do strange things

which ones? d5 or d6?

UnConeD, d5

yes
you are experience the suck that is parse_ini_file

aha

experiencing*
you can try quoting stuff

well it's not critical. not like I absolutely *need* an exclamation point

did that change in d6?

yes

thank god

i was *supposed* to be in d5
it*

well… I know we did what dries asked and used parse_ini
I guess he saw the light?

ping
PUt your description in quotes.
Actually, there was what appeared from the outside to be a knock down dragout fight between UnConeD and Dries; UnConeD submitted a mighty fine patch to get the .info files in themes, and it needed features parse_ini_file didn't have.

merlinofchaos, aha. oh well I just edited them and removed the odd chars already … they were internal modules anyway

Part of the fight included a few people working on a YAML interpreter which scared me.
Eventually Dries caved.

dopry, ping

dfletcher, pong…

hi dopry wondering whatever happened to that backref module.. did you roll it into something else?

dfletcher, no in langours.

dopry, hmm. oh well I can fake it with another node ref to point back
but it kinda sucks to have to remember that for every node

if you have time, can you see if this patch makes any difference: http://drupal.org/node/159748#comment-275505

Drupal, database system, normal, patch (code needs review), 2 IRC mentions

scary indeed. good thing its sorted out

Not a patch

doh!

Dries backing down was sort of a throwing up the hands and going "I give up" rather than conceding the point. He backed out and said Steven could commit the patch; Steven, of course, didn't want to since he wrote the patch and he prefers not to commit his own patches. That was uncomfortable.
I don't remember who eventually committed it, but it did get in and we have a more flexible .ini file system now.

how about now?

i missed out

And themes are much more interesting.

I know that. I haven't got a chance to investigate though

better I'll try it in a minute.
It's definitely a mysqli issue (I did an install using mysql and it was fine) - now I'll try the patch.
Looks like it fixed it.

ah, nice.
feel like marking that one RTBC, (as long as you don't see any code style, etc issues)?

Will do, after I read it

great, thanks

done.

thanks - that may solve a number of mystery bugs with the menu system

I mentioned that

Does anyone know if there is already a module that gives users titles based on the number of posts they've written?
bDoes anyone know if there is already a module that gives users titles based on the number of posts they've written?/b

only via combinations of things like UserBadges and UserPoints and stuff like that.

You could base it on userpoints

Too complex.

User Classes.

50) $user-name = "$user-name totally rocks!"

I'm a 9/2 fighter/thief!
Wait wrong kind of class

lol

That one should probably get considered for a backport too.

yes.

you could never be so mismatched while multi-classing
err, I mean uhh
so my really nerdy friends tell me.

Oh no way. Fighter/thief is an amazing combo in D&D3.
Because backstab is broken

hmm, i'm not sure about third edition
but in second edition you had to split XP evenly between your multi-classes
my comment was based on the 9/2
I would expect say a 7/7

In Neverwinter Nights I had a dwarf fighter/thief who dual wielded flaming, keen scimitars. Because of some broken math, he could critical hit on a hit of 12 or higher (on a D20).
Oh in 3e your classes don't have to be even
WHen you advance, you choose which class to advance

in 2e you didn't have that problem, and admittedly it was slightly unbalanced
it sounds like based on 3e math your 9/2 has an effective class of 11, meaning when you level to twelve you get to pick which class to level
but in 2e if you were a 6/6, you'd be splitting half your xp between each class and both would be going for 7, which going from 6-7 twice is a lot faster than from 11-12
basically every 2e game i've ever played had some weakling multiclasser we mocked for the first two years of the campaign
then around year 2 they'd start solo'ing dragons.

Yes, that's exactly it.
Your actual level is all your class levels added together. SO multi classing has some interesting drawbacks.

seems to me like there needs to be something in between the two
useems to me like there needs to be something in between the two/u
i've played a few weeks into a 3e campaign, but never anything prolonged
i'll take your word for it.

In part because adding 1-3 levels of rogue or sorceror gives a lot of really interesting flavor without really costing a lot.

barb/rogue/ranger

Actually, going purely even in 3e sucks, because your maximum level becomes 10/10 so you never end upw ith access to the really powerful stuff.

um, can we stick to english guys?

it seems like you'd gain much more through inate abilities of other classes than say, magical abilities

spashing for skills can do cool stuff though

Hah! Ok sure, this is #drupal not #dnd3e

because a wizard/sorceror really aren't all that useful until 7 or so
I can see how having a fighter with backstab could be neat though
anyway, i'm done discussing this

Tell that to the rogue who got sorceror so he could take 'true strike', and 'spider climb'.
Right. Must stop.
Too easy to get sucked in.

saving throw vs. nerdiness?

with the "more.." link on a view, can it link to a totally different page?

If you set $view-real_url or theme the link, yes.

can that first one be done without file access?

Hmm. If you can administer the view and set php arg code, yes.
ER, emspace
not emsearcy (sorry, need to pay better attention)

I believe so. thanks (this is for gophp5.org)
occupation hazard

I have no problems admitting that I am a serious gamer. Of course, this might be because I've spent years writing my own gaming system

and your name is merlinofchaos

Kind of a giveaway

that doesn't really speak to me as the handle of something who is particularly anti-gaming
someone, rather.

if I create a project, how long before the CVS directory is updated so I can submit my code?

hmm strange problem with a panels hook here. I implement hook_panels_content_types(), and my admin callback seems to work fine (my form appears) but when I fill out values the item appears in the pane, but without the values. weirdest part is if I open up the "Configure" fieldset after adding, the values stick. what am I missing here? this worked in 4.7.

is there any way to discern of a menu item points to a published item?
i.e. when I unpublish a page, i'd like to to be automatically removed from the navigation - possible?

I think you need to created the CVS directory first

Someone else reported something similar to that.
But I have no idea what's causing it.

merlinofchaos, hmm ok I'll compare my code more closely with other impls.

And since it's Panels 1, I'm not really paying much attention. Sorry.

sok
I mean, other implementations of the hook are working, so I'll see if I'm just doing something silly

I'm fairly close to a Panels 2 beta, though

sweet! is there a migration tool?

Yea, it migrates from Panels 1, so far all the tests have been successful

hi dmitrig01

I'm looking for a volunteer to write a dashboard migration tool, too, since the newest version can do panel nodes.

pwolanin, how do I go about creating the CVS directory?

aha merlinofchaos got it. from case 'add' in the admin callback, 4.7 expected the $_POST array to have a root ['edit
latest panels + 5, it no longer needs ['edit
jeez I can't type today
e.g. $_POST['edit']['add']['title']['title'], became $_POST['add']['title']['title'],
and yay! I think that means I'm ready to commit this panels_titles module
just one last check

dmitrig01 r u there?

Ohhhh. Yea, ['edit'] disappeared in 5.

Hmm… Looks like someone beat me to a spammer

"cvs add"

quickstart?

quickstart is http://drupal.org/handbook/cvs/quickstart

^^ useful

pwolanin, chx, thx.

I was about to post the same link

yeah. i will need it too because the time nears when I will have a contrib project again

chx, thx alot actually, that is exactly what I was looking for

hunmonk is already writing a pony module

pwolanin:

jp
oop
upgrade modules
upgrade modules?
(sorry for the fuzz)
upgrade modules?
hmm
upgrade?

Upgrade help can be found at http://drupal.org/upgrade/tutorial-introduction

upgrade module?

module update?

module update is http://drupal.org/update/modules

thanks wwwebernet
ah, it's
update module?

update module is http://drupal.org/update/modules

not upgrade
upgrade module is http://drupal.org/update/modules

Okay.

upgrade modules is http://drupal.org/update/modules

Okay.

help factoid

I saw that on the factoid page

help factoid?

and noticed that it's update, not upgrade
help factoid?

help

Botagotchi, Drupal URLs, Factoids, Function Lookups, Seen.

help factoids

cats are furry", "BOTNAME: Drupal is great.", "No, BOTNAME, Morbus is awesome.", "BOTNAME: Drupal is also powerful.", "BOTNAME: cheer is actioncheers for !who in !channel!", or "BOTNAME: ping is replyWHAT?!". Retrieve factoids with: "Drupal?" or "BOTNAME: cheer!" Forget factoids with "BOTNAME: forget ping". Factoids can be browsed online at http://www.disobey.com/bot/factoid.

is there a way to get a list of form id's?

function mymodule_form_alter($form_id, &$form) { drupal_set_message($form_id); } … then just browse to it

there's a module called 'formdefaults' that lets you browse around the entire site… it then accumulates the forms that you've seen and lists them, IIRC.

eaton, awesome, thx

merlinofchaos http://drupal.org/project/panels_titles

seen dww

dww was last seen in #drupal 3 days 20 hours ago saying 'gotta run, later folks.'.

I'll hunt through the mailing list for now

I think that won't be helpful

I'm making a bunch of changes to my (5.1) menu on my dev site, which is a copy of the live site. Rather than making the changes all over again, can I just copy over the menu table without making a total mess of things?

depends on what you changed

I've moved stuff all around into different menus and added two new menus
I suppose I'd need to hit the sequence table, too
Poking around, the menu table looked fairly self contained, so I thought I might just be able to copy that and get away with it
I've got such limited time… I hate to redo this all through the UI

i hope with d6 menu system there will be possibility for a module to do mass menu edits
ui hope with d6 menu system there will be possibility for a module to do mass menu edits/u

D6 is a loooong ways off for me, unfortunately
So, menu, sequence… Any other table I need to worry about?

make sure to rebuild cache
acutaly
make sure you do backup
that must be the smartest piece of advice i've given in a while

Yeah, definitely back up

hello everyone

Hello

is drupal overkill for a simple website for a doctor
with information
to make appointments, etc, etc

drupal is never an overkil

I don't think Drupal is ever overkill…
You never know when you'll want to expand

if the content changes from time to time
it is not overkill

you can scake drupal as down or as up as you need

obviously

scale*

but the backend looked a bit on the complicated side for my client

you can customize it
and make it as little as they need
in like 5 minutes time

if you know what you're doing

thats what we are here for ^_^

how would I do that?

lets go to the support chanel, please join
support?

Please throw a quarter in the support jar (http://association.drupal.org/donations) . #drupal is reserved for development discussions (please see channel topic). Volunteers offering live support can be found in #drupal-support. If no one is available in #drupal-support, try the forums at http://drupal.org/forum. Thank you for giving us a space to work on improving Drupal for you!

kk

ping killes

pong
please use "killes: ping" otherwise it doesn't get highlited

hi.

hello

killes, i'd asked you last week about taking over the (improperly capitalized) Metrics module. i emailed the maintainer last week and haven't heard anything back.
i wanted to check in and see if i can have dww delete that old directory so i can create the 'metrics' module

which day lat week did you mail?

i though i'd mailed it last monday but looking at the date on the email it was the 10th
which was a tuesday

well, but me again tomorrow, then.

will do

seen quicksketch*

quicksketch was last seen in #drupal 3 days 19 hours ago saying 'it's a good thing you hopped over to core for this release '.

or rather bug dww
I am ok with you taking over.

sounds good. i'll ask him about it tomorrow.

hello

can you spare a few cycles for a devel module patch which will help drupal.org testing?

Do you know offhand how to set focus to an form item in javascript, using jquery? I thought $('…').get().focus() would do it, but it doesn't.

you might have to use standard js for it, i dunno. lemme see if i can find something in the manual
focus() — Trigger the focus event of each matched element.
doesn't look like that's what you need

$().focus()
no get

No the jquery focus() is an event handler/trigger, not the same thing.

I've used it before…

http://lab.sputnik.pl/javascript/jquery_std — weird. some of those look like they overwrite the standard functions?
oh i see

merlinofchaos, .get(0).focus() doesn't work? odd I have that exact code and it's fine
err is get() the same as get(0) ?

if $().focus works, you should just use it. you'd be triggering the onfocus event anyways

It doesn't.
Aha, it's the 0 that doe sit.
Thanks!

finally I helped merlinofchaos! woo!

get gets all, get(0) gets the first…

ahhh. Sweet.

so you were probably working w/ an array w/ the object inside of it, instead of the object itself
returns ArrayElement
yup

Yea, that'd do it.

would you be interested in a house rental situation for barcelona? i'm going to scout for a week-long rental in the city…

I would, though I still haven't done the paperwork to get Charlotte a passport, so it is looking unlikely that will happen. Though there is still a chance if I get off my butt and do that we can all go.
And if Charlotte doesn't go,then I go for the minimum amount of time.

http://www.lovingbarcelona.com/groups.jsp — this looks really interesting…

That looks like the kind of thing the lullabots are doing.

is the drupal website always this slow?
I mean drupal.org

only when people are using it

(DUH!)

Heh

haha
thats a yes

it's because you're asking. stop asking

It's not always this slow, but we're having a bad month

have you donated money or time to make it faster?

seen snufkin?

snufkin was last seen in #drupal 5 hours 23 min ago saying 'Squidster++'.

I only started using it today
have you donated *money*?

people are touchy - it's been a bad month for the servers

I am not touchy

apparently

he doesn't need to. when you do as much work on drupal core as chx does, that's payment enough

I am always pressing for contributions.

drupal.org is a busy site with a lot of complex features.

kk
sorry everyone
I'm not trying to cause I fight

no worries

and I appreciate the work that you all have done
thank you

(and in case you asked me then yes i donated money to the drupal cause a hell lot more than probably any invidual)

drupal.org's performance is a work in progress

kk

This is the development channel, btw.

ok

but, look at this factoid:
support?

Please throw a quarter in the support jar (http://association.drupal.org/donations) . #drupal is reserved for development discussions (please see channel topic). Volunteers offering live support can be found in #drupal-support. If no one is available in #drupal-support, try the forums at http://drupal.org/forum. Thank you for giving us a space to work on improving Drupal for you!

I probably don't belong in here then
maybe I'll code for it sometime I have the spare time
right now I'm thinking of getting involved in compiz fusion

you should come to barcelona. you need a vacation

got a sec for a quick question about update.module?

http://news.wired.com/dynamic/stories/N/NEGLECT_INTERNET_ADDICTION_NVOL-?SITE=WIRE&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

_update_build_fetch_url()?
where's that pesky bot when you need it?

omg uppercase urls are fugly

_update_build_fetch_url:HEAD?

meth heads

time to update the api for the bot
that kind of thing does not surprise me

http://api.drupal.org/api/HEAD/function/_update_build_fetch_url

http://drupal.org/user/163692/track

indeed
thank you

when do you think you will start development on views 2?

Oh, I'm definitely going to Barcelona. Just not sure if we all are which means I dunno how long I'm going.
I'm not sure. Probalby 2-3 weeks.

cool

I want to ahve Panels 2 at least as a beta first.

pastebin?

Pastebin.com is back! Please don't paste code directly into IRC. Please use http://drupal.pastebin.co.uk/, http://www.pastebin.ca/ or http://pastebin.com

pastebin.com is soooooooooo slow

drupal.pastebin.co.uk

fast for me

And get rid of the 56K modem

yeah… its well slow
http://drupal.pastebin.co.uk/19424 - anyone see anything wrong with this menu callback? when any user but uid=1 it seems, it just shows '2' on th page
as uid, works fine. tried clearing the cache/reset_menus several times
^uid=1

Sadly I hate pastebin.co.uk

http://pastie.textmate.org

you know of an easy way to get total # of posts in forums for a particular site ?

db_query("SELECT count(*) FROM {node} WHERE uid = %d AND type = 'forum'", $uid);
Ok that's for a given user but that part can be left out
Comments need to be counted separately too

oui thank you mate

is there a way to set a page or a menu callback not to cache at all?

I believe there was just a module posted that let you set up 'don't cache' paths

i think you want access=true

array(true)…

ahhh… okay, i'll try that, i was just thinking something similar
thanks

http://www.sphinxsearch.com/ looks interesting…

hmm… didn't work

ping

hmm, Drupal 5 has proven to be very stable and secure
no sechole in the last couple of months

you trying to jinx it?

no
we were at 4.7.4 or something at code freeze for 5

ping
when you get a chance: how about something like this for panels: http://dev.jquery.com/view/trunk/plugins/ui/layouts/layout.html

Er, what are you suggesting?

for the flexible layout
try dragging the sides

Oh. Yea. That's exactly what I want.
Pity it's not obvious those are draggable

ya

:P

how do i set redirection page on register?

litwol, I believe logintobaggan(sp) can do that? otherwise, you could hook_form_alter() and set a #redirect.

right
but what is the form ID for registration/

user_register?

http://api.drupal.org/api/5/function/user_register

ya

or at the top of your form_alter, do drupal_set_message($form_id) and browse to it - that's my generic solution

oh nice
this is even better than print_r approach!

seen dww

dww was last seen in #drupal 3 days 23 hours ago saying 'gotta run, later folks.'.

seen dww*

dww was last seen in #drupal 3 days 23 hours ago saying 'gotta run, later folks.'.
dww-food was last seen in #drupal 1 week 2 days ago saying 'bjaspan: you mean all the warnings about {system} ?'.
dww_ was last seen in #drupal 1 week 4 days ago saying 'later, folks.'.

soon coming into contrib is the ultra-awesome form_alter_api

check out the field spotter module

dmitrig01, cool I've been thinking about something like that!

very cool indeed - will make flexible panels - uhhh… more flexible

dmitrig01, probably not - I had a devil of a time trying to picure a decent UI for it

hi - is drupal.org down?

down?

Yes, it's possible that drupal.org is down, but be assured that Druplicon is fighting to get it back online!

do yuo know what I have in mind even?

no, seems up actually

dmitrig01, well no but I'm assuming you could do common stuff like changing #redirect, #title, #description, #weight, etc.

sry

no!

no?

I have something totally diffreent in mind
a) hook_form_improvements()

well, don't keep me in suspense! hehe

which specifies an improvemennt
e.g. make thiss for more like this

Druplicon?

I am Drupal's bot.module, coded and hosted by Morbus Iff. More at http://drupal.org/project/bot - plugins are easy, and patches are welcome! Now powered exclusively by mega-sauce!

which automatically hooks it up with a settings page

is also a ham.

b) hook_(unknown)

Druplicon is also a ham.

Okay.

which specifies ways to modify in a custom way

Druplicon?

Druplicon is replyI am Drupal's bot.module, coded and hosted by Morbus Iff. More at http://drupal.org/project/bot - plugins are easy, and patches are welcome! Now powered exclusively by mega-sauce! and is also a ham.

like a checkbox to hide fields

power-supply arrived. as per your question about the service contract, I'd ask kieran; he talked to them on the phone more, by the time I talked to them all they needed from me was the mailing address

it provides a way to store the altered form

!botsnack

I have no idea
botsnack

this is why I love #drupal

botsmack

dmitrig01-smack

the thing is gone - good

O_O

dmitrig01, well I think I'd need to see sample code before I pass judgement hard to tell what you mean from that desc.

he speaks!

ok

ah
you don't need to !
he just spies on you and speaks by himself
die
nope

hi

oh how weird!

on a drupal configured for mysqli, what's the variable holding the mysqli object?

i do drupal_set_message($form_id); and then i do a test if the form_id == one of the outputed values
and it fails!

o_O

even though i see it on the sccreen through drupal_Set_message

pastebin?

Pastebin.com is back! Please don't paste code directly into IRC. Please use http://drupal.pastebin.co.uk/, http://www.pastebin.ca/ or http://pastebin.com

Kieran wants to have "Dell Service Tags", any idea where to get these?

oh

http://pastebin.com/d57dcabe6

excuse my (dont even kno what to call it)
i forgot to uncomment the print_R +die()

heheh whoops

that's hook_form_improvement

dmitrig01, yeah I gathered

how do yhou like it?

well it seems like a fancy way to avoid if() or switch() in hook_form_alter at first glance ;P

welll

'strpos', what does that do?

the reason is it replaces another module with this functionality

ah

hello drupalers

that checks if strpos($form_id, #info) !== FALSE
greetings slantview

if I implement openID now in 5.x will it "upgrade gracefully" to the 6.x version?
(and whatever you answer can I add to the http://drupal.org/project/openid page?)

other options are function, which calls something custom, or regex

i was going to ask if there is a working group for refactoring D7 into an OO based system?

if ($form_id == 'foo') do_this($form); else if ($form_id=='bar') do_that($form) .. isn't if statements simpler? oh or can this match on more than just form_id?

Probably not for D7. Maybe like D9

see the http://drupal.org/gophp5 thread

i set #redirect through _form_edit (did print_r to make sure it did set the value!) but when i submit my registration it doesnt redirect anywhere (

well i don't see why not, php5.2 … OO ?
thank you

in places where there are obvious benefits, I think there is not much resistance. but refactoring to OO just for the sake of being buzzword compliant is not likely.

not buzzword

this has a settings page too

extensibility and code saving

you say the same thing too often (dww too for that matter)

also, for not hacking core

heh

a link to a thread would suffice

Fair enough.

and free you to work on more important things
like making fivestar support ratings in addition to votes

im sure this is highly debated no doubt

heheh
or refactoring actions.module! ;D

indeed

is there good examples of actions code somewhere
that is definitely an area i would like to catch up

informal poll:

O_o

so you know when forums give you some kind of rating next to your name, like "Newbie" or "You have way too much time on your hands"… what would you call this feature?

custom title
but i've never been one for names

overall its just user forum titles

userometer

the fact that they are custom is just 'expected'

well, they are usually earned no?

userometer is funny name too

user post titles?

yeah, I'll send them to him

So is webchick asking about that after you were just a coincidence, merlinofchaos? Or are you guys working on something?

mwahahahaaa!

maybe call it "karma" or use that in the name. seems similar to /. karma system, except with labels

it's really user titles. posted on a forum.
or possibly in their profile.
so actually.
don't put forum in it, probably.
user_names
hahaha

Not really karma, though, since it's just sheer number of posts, not what people rate you as…

there is just no non-ambiguous way to name this module.

thanks!

Just user titles sounds good to me

arbitrary_user_titles_assigned_based_on_number_of_forum_posts.module
But!

But nothing!

Then you can related them to posts or whatever you want

just call them t

lol

please CC me

You could like.

I was asking about it in another IRC room, so it's not a coincidence.

ACTIONS-ENABLE IT.

Maybe user post titles

And then you could get titles for totally arbitrary crap.

seen rdouglass*?

rDouglass was last seen in #drupal 2 weeks 3 days ago saying 'I just pm'd you… see me?'.
rDouglass_ was last seen in #drupal 3 weeks 3 days ago saying ''m not authenticated'.
rdouglass|away was last seen in #drupal 19 weeks 5 days ago saying 'The Chinese government has hired Lullabot to build a firewall'.

weeks ago?

or you could do something sane.

merlinofchaos - Ah, I thought it was funny that you two would both be looking at the same thing like that

he is still alive

It's for work
Tho I'll probably put the module in contrib.
Yay another module to maintain

Yes. You guys are helping the teenie boppers of tomorrow!

Cool, I'll snap that up for my site

lol aw.

Should be a fairly simple one, though, shouldn't it?
Not like maintaining oh, say, views

I'd call that userbadges

I was gonna hack something for titles… Will just wait on your module

userpoints!

There's already a user badges / user points modules

Yes, except user badges apparently already exists and does something different.

Should be simple enough.

Michelle: (I know there's a userbadges module and my point is that if you actions enable userbadges it does what you want)

TBH, it sounds like the 3 of them could be rolled together in a package

def

I was totally kidding about actions-enabling
cos that would just be completely insane.

I use userpoints already. Have user badges on my to look at list

well…are you going to achieve this via a query on every theme_username?
no, I imagine it's going to be cached

module_disable?

http://api.drupal.org/api/5/function/module_disable

someone needs to actions-enab;e every module :

which means you're rewriting 90% of userbadges
or, patching it to do what you need for 20% more code

one can

Roll the three together and you get something where you could get a title based on number of posts or number of points (admin choice) and you get either a badge or a title or both (again admin choice)

one can't love CCK enough
$profile-{$key}[0][$k] = '';
took me _hours_ to figure this one out.
BLEH!

That would be a killer module for forums

I can't enable a module

support?

Please throw a quarter in the support jar (http://association.drupal.org/donations) . #drupal is reserved for development discussions (please see channel topic). Volunteers offering live support can be found in #drupal-support. If no one is available in #drupal-support, try the forums at http://drupal.org/forum. Thank you for giving us a space to work on improving Drupal for you!

$active_db

no

Er, you pinged me earlier and I missed it

they're all ignoring me

support and?

If someone doesn't answer in #drupal-support it doesn't mean you have license to be off topic in #drupal. Your next avenue for support is the Drupal forums (http://drupal.org/forum). Please respect the channel topic.

i was going to ask you something about update.module but i think i figured it out

ah ok

I just had a great idea! I want to make this game that teaches you drupal coding so subtly, you don't even realize it. when you win, you're an expert ;P

you could call it "build a contrib module"!

I know
I'm just a selfish person

array(true) and is this the correct functionality or should 'true' work as well?

just spent ages until i figured it out!

quick question in regards to admin modules page?

seen walkah

walkah was last seen in #drupal 16 hours 30 min ago saying ''.

I think the code compares to the number 1. for 6.x, I assume

yeah, 6.x

see _menu_check_access: if (is_numeric($callback))

i'm so used to using true instead of 1 it tricked me out

probably should allow boolean too

http://www.drupal4hu.com/node/51

yeah is_numeric || is_boolean would suit me fine

sure

in fact, the code comment there is misleading: // Check for a TRUE or FALSE value.

lol http://www.lightsphere.com/dev/web20.html

I hate using objects just to use objects.

heh, yeah. i'll write a patch. you okay with that chx, or are you fundamentally against htat?

I want arrays. And more arrays.

your post needs some formatting help, I'm afraid

i don't want to tread on your code

i think you are mistaken

?

i believe you write TRUE on your menu deifniton but when that comes back from the database it's a '1'

yeach, I'm confused too - that should come back fmor the DB cast to int

i am just curious as to how we should deal with admin page 'by-module' when the administer item has been moved from teh navigation menu to either primary/secondary or a user defined menu

module_invoke , preg_replace (%w[a-z_0-9]+), '%', $keys) make an array which maps router maps to modules and be done
s/router maps/router links
(hope the answer was fast enough.)

hmm… all i know is true doesn't work, but 1 does

chx huh?
you meant flk?

it was to me

I think that was for flk

yes
sorry
the by-module page is not yet coded.
if it's moved it's not there

what DB are you using?

i have been through this w/ pwolanin many a times
does not matter the menu insert code throughly casts it to an integer
the very reason for using menu system to generate that accursed page is to make ti customizable

yes, of course - it has to via %d at least

my example was moving rarely used links to a separate menu and make it a dashboard
yea
but to avoid fuckups i do a cast before.

mysql. just triple confirmed it. array(true) doesn't work, array(1) does work

then someone removed muy code
no it's there
what array?
if (is_bool($item['access callback'])) {
$item['access callback'] = intval($item['access callback']);
}

i see, so if it is moved not our problem to deal with..

yyyy

access arguments

I think for the by-module page all links should show

no.

try 'access callback'

is_bool… access arg or callback?

i can understand that though for by task but by-module is where you find out wtf modules do etc

callback

Services Canada turned my job offer down because not enough documentation was supplied
uServices Canada turned my job offer down because not enough documentation was supplied/u

i get errormessage when i pass white space into an auto complete field

i dont know i somehow feel as though even if the administer item is moved we should be able to show modules and their abilities there

i am not sure what could be the case

and you're using absolute in useless use

]zip

* { margin: 0; padding: 0; }. You'll save yourself the confusion over quite a few strange element and browser spacing differences later on. * == http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/selector.html#universal-selector

1.u need relative to the parent element
and why absolute for one element?
use margin and width
you don't nothing more
height is made by contents

can anyone help me with my problem?

I want it to be 100% height so I can vert-align a div afterwards in it.

@http://www.dellas5and10.com/beta

(www.dellas5an…) HTML: Failed (34 errors, see http://tinyurl.com/32emtg ) | CSS: Failed (2 errors, see http://tinyurl.com/yths65 ) [6 warnings] | DOCTYPE: XHTML 1.0 Trans + url | (MIME: text/html, text/html;
charset=iso-8859-1)

don't use height:100% please
it's a thing that i hate
ziki18 fix those errors
height is made by contents

i need to have two different backgrounds i have the left background on the main container and then the other one on the right side floating div. also, i have one div that contains just a large image. it doesnt seem to stretch the div and therefore runs into the div below it (at least that is how
it is being rendered in firefox). changing it to have a min-height of 100% instead of just height: 100% didnt change anything. Sample: http://cerno

i'm having that same problem

well im glad im not alone

100% should works
but it's a freak thing, imo

How can you vertically center an image in an absolutely positioned div? The div has a fixed width, but no height (100% of the page). I'm trying to create a left navigation column on a horizontally scrolling page, where the navigation column never disappears.

height is made by contents.
]dead center @ smokingtrucks
]css dead center @ smokingtrucks

]css dead center @ sembiance
]dead center @ sembiance
hrm

poor _ZofBot3 too busy

bot down?

ahh deadcenter

i'm against vertical-alignment anyway…

]deadcenter

http://reisio.com/examples/deadcenter/

obert, Sembiance =P

thanks

… nebies

thanks too

your page has errors, and it's not using a strict doctype

just tested deadcenter.. works in IE6, Safari Win32, Opera Linux, Konqueror and Firefox, neat ;

Sembiance, you can do this in the other way too
http://innonesen.se/test/l-2/
if you make #top in this example to be 100% height of html , you will get 'deadcenter'

Say I've got a table inside of a div, I can assign a style to the div, but not directly to the table inside, how can i style the table?
can i do something like div.mystyle{ #tr{ border:thick;}}

no

there is no way to do it?

what is it you want to do

i've got a table inside of a div
i can assing a style to the div, but i can't assign one to the table
i need to style the table

you can do that

how so?

div.mystyle table { color: red; }

div.class table{style stuff}

will make the table red

oh ok
you are awesome
thanks

how would i force a div to span the lenght of a large image?
right now the image is just spilling out of the div

set div width to 100%

that doesnt work

can some one take a look at this http://aidan.homelinux.com/Websites/cana/ and see why my two main sections dont haev the same height and also why my footer appears behind them.

Can someone point me to an article on correctly using heading tags. I think i got it right, i just want to make sure

tags… line 74

and no doc type

@http://www.dellas5and10.com/beta

(www.dellas5an…) HTML: Failed (42 errors, see http://tinyurl.com/32emtg ) | CSS: Failed (2 errors, see http://tinyurl.com/yths65 ) [6 warnings] | DOCTYPE: XHTML 1.0 Strict + url | (MIME: text/html, text/html;
charset=iso-8859-1)

is there a way to alternate rows of a table as well?
altenrate the colors that i
is

not sure how…

you have to alternate it manually

oh ok

Can you get dynamically the computed height of an element via JS?
I dont think you can…

hi there .. was wondering if there is any way to align contents of a input fiel to the right side ?

help.. I have crappy bold text and I need help
All I did is "font-weight: bold;"..
it is only crappy in IE6

link?

http://www.flyingsoft.phatcode.net/flowers/contact.pl
click "preview" first
it's for the error message text

@

(www.flyingsof…) HTML: Failed (15 errors, see http://tinyurl.com/29pfjg ) | CSS: Failed (4 errors, see http://tinyurl.com/2uwon7 ) [1 warnings] | DOCTYPE: XHTML 1.1 | (MIME: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1)

jajaja

15 errors? more like 92

is there anything that could cause crappy bold text in ie6 with css?

I don't even have a preview button in IE7
the textarea and the button don't show up

can someone take a look at my page in IE and tell me if it looks right (as in nothing blatently wrong)? www.trinitygc.com

can you set the value of "rel" in a stylesheet for a?

odd..

you're using the wrong doctype it seems
use html hosting 4.01 strict
http://htmlhelp.com/tools/validator/doctype.html

JoeyJoeJo, does using flash for what could be done with an animated gif count?
i saw the little tab for adblock plus next to the image on the left and did a double take on that

wait a sec..

yeah, im not using ie, i just peeked anyway

I thought it was "/style"?
not "style/"?

doesn't gif only support 256 colors?

i was wondering if there is any way to align contents of a input fiel to the right side ?

without needing to run JS though it to add a class?

Is there a way to align a text input off the side of the div instead of the text that is before it?

JoeyJoeJo, yeah
im not sure how much loss youd get with that though

In firefox you can, it's li:first-child or li:last-child

on the front page, was the "welcome to trinity" text off the page?

can i set something like div.thumb a { rel:external;} or is that not possible?
JoeyJoeJo, the image on the left
im trying to look at it in IE, but IE is crashing
JoeyJoeJo, its just the images of buildings on the bottom left

the "welcome to trinity" text is just above the flash images
at least it should be

JoeyJoeJo, on IE/Mac the text looks like it's in the right place
though some of the images for the text on the tabs arent loading
im getting 'about us' 'team' then a red x 'news' 'employment' then the symbol that means there should be an image, with the alt-text being 'contact'
oh wait reloading fixed it
when you have rel="external" on links (or in this case rel="thumb" since its for thumbnails that have pop-outs) can you put rel:external; in a style sheet for that a?

can some one take a look at this http://aidan.homelinux.com/Websites/cana/ and see why my two main sections dont haev the same height and also why my footer appears behind them.

I have a products page where each product (64×64 image, name, price, status) are floated left. However if the product name is extra long the height is higher. If the high element is on the right side then all products wrapped under that one are completely under it, but if its near the left, then
the wrapping is all warped and the item appears in two rows. How can I fix this without grouping each row (so that if the window changes size more
any ideas?

for each product, and insert the image floating left in it, plus the text.

anyone any ideas about my issue?

thats what im doing

Then I don't get your problem, then.

sec ima upload an example

wanderingii, two sec.

hello

Hi

ok thanks.

wanderingii, the website seems to be okay, here?

u using ie7?

FF
I see problems in IE6

with JS but when i move them :first-child and :last-child don't get reapplied… how can i force it?

the background is supposed to be white, and the two sections arent the same height, and my footer appears behind the two boxes

Scotepi, that might be a #javascript question

there in a heavy depate about html5 and xhtml2
debate

just item.setClass = "yourclass"
If that's the problem
..className*
wanderingii, the two sections?
You mean your menu, and your content?

heres the example http://subonedesign.com/test/

SubOne, it's loading now… Might take a few minutes, due to my ISP :/

eww

Okay, that's a wierd way to set it up.
I thought about 1 product a line

yes

wierd way how

I'm using FF
I'd have 1 product a line.

well this is the way im doing it so..

I hate IE lol

Then, what was the problem then?
-then*
JamesSavko, don't we all?

i hate it too but at the minute its the only browser my sites more or less workin on.

I hate spending hours redoing code so that they are more or less the same in IE and FF =(

the problem was the item near the bottom left throws all the bottom ones to the right instead of flush underneath the row

JamesSavko, just start making it browsercompitable when you start.

,

no idea then?

Oh sorry, I was in a PM
That's the problem with floats.
Idk if a clear would do the job.

no because a clear would mean i defined the number of items per line

is that similar to mine becuase im using floats

i mean i suppose i could limit the text to one line but thats not really what i want to have to do

You could limit the text
If hovering show the rest of the text.

isn't vertical-align suitable for ?

Tagg:huh?

]vertical-align
]]vertical-align

what of it

[Google] http://www.w3schools.com/css/pr_pos_vertical-align.asp (More results: http://tinyurl.com/34pgy5 )

in the

i suppose the hover thing would be ok
but any other suggestions?

I have got no other solutions, I'm affraid

but it wouldn't be easy to limit it to one line i dont think
no way to know the width of the text

and i can't manage to make mytext being vertical-aligned on the bottom

what are you trying to vertically align?

"mytext"
do i have to style the div, the p or the span ?

ah
]]deadcentre

[Google] http://www.everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=850629 (More results: http://tinyurl.com/28v7lh )

hi
I have a div, which has a backgound upload your images online and text
the problem is that the bg image has the height of the text height

http://www.wpdfd.com/editorial/thebox/deadcentre4.html

and not of the actual image

you'll have to manually set the height of the block

I have put the div as display:inline (because I don't want the line break) and a height, height of the image
but the height has no effect

display:block;
ah

div is already display block by default
but then i have a line break

it must be block to set height

if you don't want the line break, try floating

it must be possible …

float:left;

ah ok, i'll try that, tomorrow

or set its parent element to position:relative; and the div as position:absolute

yes

but float should be sufficient

thank you, I didn't think of this

so no other suggestions on my problem?

SubOne, not without grouping each row

yeah, but trying to avoid that since that would stop me from being able to dynamically change the number of items per row according to the space available
will overflow:hidden stop the text wrapping?

SubOne, contain the entire contents in a div, overflow:hidden; max-height: and height:

left issue? Works in firefox not IE…. links refuse to click
http://jewelry.neoeliteusa.com

How do I get it to fit itself to what is inside, instead of going all the way to the right ?

display: inline; or set a width

Can I help someone try to figure my issue out?
I can't do it alone but I can at least help someone trying to help me

are you realying on li:hover or something?

Well reguardless… I should be able to click on the link
the li:hover is ONLY for decoration

good night.

sec lemme check it

The links are completly non-responcsive

i cant even select the text there

#main { display: inline; (existing settings) made the box go away
that 'shifty' is neat but kinda anoying

sorry brb my son is calling
damn kid
is it on the page?

I'm aware… I was going to make it only shift 5px… than Boss called and said it didn't work in his IE

ill get back to you in one sec

Thank you

must you make the size change or do you just want to get rid of the background color?

I want the white box to only be as wide as the longest line inside
so that more of that lovely background image can be seen

why is it floated?
center is not valid

leftovers from me trying shots in the dark

well float:center isnt valid
#main {display: inline;margin: 5px 5px 5px 160px;padding: 0 15px;text-align: left;}#main table {background-color: white;}

float:center gone (and those anoying tabs )

although the margins wont help you apparently
set padding for the table i guess
are you doing anything strange to that portion with js?
also you should remove all padding from the LI and add it to the A so that the link is the full size of the menu item

No javascript at all in the project as-of now

are you testing on windows?

Does not resolve issue…. uploading to production server now…
Linux Lamp

Try Windows

i'm using IE on linux
…. still not working though

try using IE in Windows… Sometimes odd things happen to me in ie4linux
these seems like it may be one of them

Already give me a min to get the laptop running\

I want to use #main for all my 'content' so setting the background in the table isn't going to work

in which case you want to set a width so that your content doesnt just flow off to the right

]firebug

FireBug, a FireFox extention, useful for JS/CSS coding: https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/1843/ (by Joe Hewitt http://www.joehewitt.com/ )

is it possible to have a div tag appear eventhough its empty as to show the set background ?

but I do want it to just flow off to the right if there is something to flow

Same error

set a width and height
hmm, can you select the text?
i cant even try it in ie7 my ie7 isnt working lol

no i can not

anyone know a css layout example with a header, a footer and two colums for the body?

hmm

you might want to use QEMU on your linux box to run win/ie

is there a validator in this room?
Line 64, Column 25: ID "navcontainer" already defined.
Line 65, Column 28: ID "navlist" already defined.
Line 96, Column 123: ID "extra" already defined.

But that normally don't matter…. it should still work
…. ether way i'll make it a class.

well try fixing that first

I agree

let me know when its uploaded

for some reason it seems to ignore height:

display:block;?

just to be on top?

i have to read that a few more times lol
oh you want the div to be hovered above the text and not have the text interupted?

Yes.

try position fixed maybe?

fixed; worked like a charm… not in IE6

grr

It was fine in FF :/
]]]position fixed

fixed http://www.webdevout.net/browser-support-css#support-css2propsbasic-position (IE 6: N) (IE 7: I)(FF 1.5: Y) (FF 2: Y) (Opera 8.5: Y) (Opera 9: Y) (Konqueror 3.5: (Safari 2: )

of course

See.

Uploaded

whats *I*?

no i am not using display : block ;

I don't know.
It think it's a partly yes

why not
absolute?

I'll try

at least see what it does in ie

Anyone know of a fix to make Safari not have a rendering heart attack when it tries to render an absolutely position element off of a inline element?

even with block the hight is ignored

is the parent element set to relative positioning?
in IE?

and firefox

SubOne, yes… This works great for FF, but not for IE.

and some reason why you cant put   or soemthign inside of ti?

yes

Oh, wait.

not sure i dont have safari

No, it doesn't work as intended for IE6

sorry

Basically there is a UL inside a span, display:none'd. On span:hover, I set display:block on the ul.

http://juhp.dk/ls/

I'm gonna go eat now but i'll be back in a little while… I have uploaded the new version to http://jewelry.neoeliteusa.com/ … i'm still getting the same non-responsive links in IE

what does it do in safari?
what am i lookin at

The menu to the left.
It require Js.
Try hover it, in IE6.
Works great for FF

Well it renders the UL kinda sorta, like the right 1/2 is missing…then the same setup a little further to the right doesn't render at all when ul:hover

perhaps its a sizing issue?
sorry i cant offer much help, never messed with safari

maybe - it works totally fine in IE 6/7 and FF. And if I set my span to display:block, it renders it tottally fine
in Safari

any particular reason you are using javascript for it?

why most of myspace users are stupid americans ?

Well… I didn't find a solution without it.

i could

How would you do?

unfortunately i dont have that sort of patience atm… my kids are driving me nuts :p

Let me have them for some time ?

sure
lemme look at the code..

hello again CSS peeps

Hello

here's a Q on CSS validation
what can I replace onload, onfocus, and "wrap" with for HTML 4.01?
the validator says that these attributes don't exist

Why not use XTML?
XHTML*

too strict, and apparently not enough compatibility

!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-strict.dtd"

aaaaaaaaaa
no
you dont did it

but can anyone answer my question…
?

gimme a few mins working with Multiply

Multiply, dont call for flamewars
please

mefisto, I didn't o.o

no, you actually did it , luck for you, most of warriors sleep

put menu-left inside of menu-hide

agamemnus, onLoad, onFocus are valid attributes for certain elements. I don't know what "wrap" is, but i imagine it's supposed to be the CSS white-space property

and use hover techniques to make it all css

maybe it's because I used "onload" instead of "onLoad" then?

Hover techniques?

i may make you an example in a few mins

Thank you.

try it lol

mefisto, why would that be a flamewar?
It was just a suggestion o.o

i prefer not to put javascript code in with the content anyway… i attach handlers through an external js file

I'm back have any luck?

maybe because it's in an image tag?

sorry havent looked i have like 3 people asking me queries

i'm not going to make my code any more complicated than it needs to be

thats the point… if you add javascript attributes to tags you are over complicating the code

It's alright, I do know it works fine with float: left taken off…. but tell me when you get a minute

agamemnus, onload isn't supported for images i imagine.

k

oh well. thanks.

]html image
]html img

http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/struct/objects.html#edef-IMG

I only have 3 validation errors and Mozilla/IE have no problem with them

ok bbl, ima mock up an example for Multiply

Thank you.

Please, can anyone tell me what a FEED (the professional) does in a web project?

rss feed?

I need to wrap a content div with a drop shadow type thing, any easy way to do it?

have you seen 456bereast article on the issue?

DjalmaAraujo, ever used google ?
or wikipedia ?
and which feed you are talking about

http://www.456bereastreet.com/lab/transparent-custom-corners-borders-v2/
that's the link

and what it has to do with css ?

it uses javascript, but its pretty good unobtrusive stuff

I need to wrap the content div with other divs

right

i think this should do… lemme upload
http://subonedesign.com/test2/

I'll check

no javascript involved
however for ie6 you will need to use hover.htc for it to work
which is perfectly easy to implement
just make sure you include the htc file through a IE conditionally commented in stylesheet since it is not valid css

I've heard about that one before
So, you only made changes to the menu part?

i changed the structure of the menu yes and added a single css rule
and changed the old rules to another name

Okay.

that page should stay up for a while so take your time

I've got .right and .left — floats to their respective sides of the page. But why is the .right part always on the bottom of the screen? Can't I make it appear nice and floating at the top?

Thank you.

damn kids lost my remote

there are more .left-divs than .right-divs though

link?

do div's have a built in height? I can't figure out why this div is cutting of the bottom of the image
when I put div height=1000px its okay, but if I leave it off it cuts off the bottom of the image

try putting the right floated element before everything else in the markup

Question….

Answer…

wow, that worked

Can you create an empty div and fill it with color?

Did you doubt my powers?
try adding 7nbsp;
er  

was any of that directed to me? ;p

ok cool SubOne

sorry lemme read up didnt see your query

just wanted to make sure
lol

what image are you talking about?
bgimage?

yes

bgimage has no effect on the size of an element
only its content
or height/width

so if no height is specified, and the bg web hosting for online images is larger than the content, it will cut off the bg image?

that is correct

thank you
that explains it

yw
does vicadin make you shake?

SubOne, I don't get it… I tried to implent your CSS, now I'm using all your CSS instead of mine, but the website is screwed?

howso

http://juhp.dk/ls/ in FF

hehe

What did I do wrong?

sec
oh ic… you broke it lol
bastard trying to make me look bad

Sorry :/

lemme diff it

Diff?

yeah
sec'

If I copypaste the hole code, it seems to work, lol.

looks like maybe you added an extra div
i mean /div
line 487

Doh __'

what OS you on

Win
Now I'm going to play with a menu to the right instead

try WinDiff

left elements off the screen the that a page is scrolled sideways instead of up\down ?

or WinMerge

]]WinDiff

[Google] http://www.grigsoft.com/download-windiff.htm (More results: http://tinyurl.com/yqujse )

no

:P

they will be wrapped

Is there a way around this?

i use Kompare
display: inline instead of float maybe

Isn't that poorly supported?

Is Kompare for win too?

idk, honestly i'm not too interested in helping someone make a page scroll horizontally
i think it is the worst "artistic" thing anyone can do
at least functionally
no.. KDE

I'll try WinMerge too
]]WinMerge

[Google] http://winmerge.org/ (More results: http://tinyurl.com/23akf4 )

lol, fair enough.

But I'm going to use JS anyway.

i think winmerge is a little better but there are many diff/merge apps with lots of pros and cons
WHAT?!

I'm going to use AJAX.
I use your menu, of course

oh
better
hunt you down

I thought so

hack out the javascript hosting capabilities from your brain
sigh… i dont even know why im here… my project is way behind scedule
or schedule… one of those

What are you working at?

please add a margin or something to your content…
its bumping into my menu
lol
working on a ground-up cms for a company

I know :p
I'm not done editing the content

remember my http://localhost/subonedesign.com/rdf/admin/products.php issue

Local :p
But yes, I do

oops
grr

It's fine
I want a Mac :/

why

TextEdit

?

Use aptana
=]

Aptana?
Is that for win?

http://apatana.tv presentations of interface

I've heard of this… E?

its OS independent

I think it was E.

its an plugin for eclipse

bad link

damn

I just love TextEdit :/

http://aptana.tv presentations of interface
a href="http://aptana.tv"http://aptana.tv/a presentations of interface
Multiply, can TectEdit do this ?
http://aptana.tv/movies/aptana_browser_support/Browser%20Support.html

http://www.textedit.org/ ?

I'll check

i just use kwrite

Corrently I use notepad
Currently*

wasnt you talking about http://macromates.com/

i use gvim

TextMate

Oh lol
It's TextMate yes
Doh XD

have you tried notepad2?

Nope.

Eclipse is much superior

The reason I like notepad is that it loads within a second.

http://www.flos-freeware.ch/notepad2.html

And it takes 0 ram.
Well, not 0, but nothing.

notepad2 is small too, but has some great other features like syntax hiliting

I'd like one with some regex search-engine
That'd be cool

kwrite has a regex search

It's not for win, is it?

whats regex

no

Damn.

regular expressions

ah ty

im not fluent at regex though

eclipse too has regexp search
and aptana has index-based search inside projects

Eclipse for win?

eclipse is INDEPENDENT

Cool

didntr eclipse start out in VB?

just meant to say that

theres so much to learn…
not enough effin hours in a day

eclipse started out as JAva IDE
VB sux

Eclipse is written in java, so it can be ported basicly everywhere where java servlet hosting is, that's a lot of platforms

If Eclipse doesnt take that much ram, I'm going to try it

must have been another one named the same

it takse quite a lot

Crap

its a full ide

Multiply, it's java, so quite some

I guessed so.

its not an IDE
its a platform

its not?

more than ide indeed

basic eclipse gives you java

it has some installers too, and dunno what secret dark arts too

lol

Wohoo
Notepad2 sounds great for me.

i could use some intellisense in kwrite
i want custom intellisense

extended eclipse gives you java/ruby/pyton/c++/pascal/uml2/html/javascript/air/css/and so on

theres also a tutorial on there how to replace Windows's notepad with it

SubOne, I dont need that

SubOne, you Visual Studio doesnt give you a free built in UML tool
does it ?
and you cant run it on MAC
or PCBSD

i havent used it in months

or on old windows

KDevelop

kdevelop is more for c++/qt
it started out as qt ide

i thought thats what you meant
i never used VS for anything else
except c++

you SHOULDNT have used it for c++ aty all

why

WinMerge is nice.

why you need so heavy IDE ?
you can do c++ in DevCpp
or gedit

it was what was used at where i worked at the time, and it integrated well with the plugins that were required
mostly source control'

I simply loooove Notepad2

thought you might

oh , forgot to mention that eclipse has full svn/cvs/git/somemoreshit integration

Regex search!

i think we were using subversion
er
i mean
shit i forget what it was called

svn = subversion

i know
it started with an S :p

its only mainstream version control system i heard of
which starts with S

it was a commercial product i think

Why didn't you say that NotePad2 existed?

forget the name

It's simply.. great

i did!

Yes, now.
And I'm glad you did.

you cant use freeware for creating commertional stuff

supercalafragalisticexpialadoshus

svn has bsd licence

it wasnt svn

so what was it
surprise me

cant remember
it had a gui…

(sftp doesnt count as version control)

lol

and svn has GUIs

And I like the fact that it's opensource

as vell it has plugind for VS
*well

oh wait i can ask my old coworker…
damn i was way off perforce

mefisto.. you can't use freeware for creating commercial stuff?
Since when?

yes you can

Exactly…

YOU CAN

Line 86, Column 123: ID "extra" already defined

you cant use freeware for creating commertional stuff

thats what i saw

FAMN
DAMN
FUCKL
TYPO

i love your spelling of commercial too

mefisto typod

loser lol
j/k

FUCKL?
Oh dear…

lol

I think you have the possessed keyboard

how do you code a paragraph with a class inside a div with a class?

div class="some1"p class="some2./div

that's HTML
I mean in css

yeah…
be more specific
div p {}

The div and the p both have a class

.some1 .some2{}

THEN ADD EM

ah ok

div.some1 p.some2{}

yeah im lost.. are we talking like neophyte css?

thanks SubOne

is it so hard to use that grey stuff between your ears ?

I am new yes

lol

its not about 'new'
its about logic

grey stuff? O.O

http://www.w3schools.com/css/default.asp
is your brain grey or is he trying to say we think with our grey matter?
i wonder if grey matter is really grey in color
or is it gray

SubOne, I did not know you could add a second class to the selector

it pisses me off that there are two spellings for grey

SubOne, me too :/

grey is the correct spelling for grey

yes try taking a simple introductory css tutorial, there are many other selector tricks

Cool

pray is color UNIT

gray is normally a surname or something

and i would assume that gray is the correct spelling for gray?

*gray

SubOne.. thats a common mistake =]

http://macromates.com/
damn

greyuisf is the correct spelling for gray

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_(unit)

is that kind of like "one of the words in this sentence is spelled incorrectly"?

I'm so in love right now… It's incredible.
I'm sure I tried almost every feature in the program now

lol

gray is 'merican, grey is english

Multiply, what program?

so then its gray :p

Notepad2, lol.
I use gray
And grey, lol.

no , SubOne , that just states you (by default) are idiot

make sure you set the option to show only the filename in the titlebar… that can get annoying looking for the right one in the taskbar

The coders notepad!

because americans are idiots

Yeah

that is a very well deserved stereotype i'm sure…

saddly, it aint stereotype

So you are making the assumption that I am in fact an idiot?

stereotype is what hollywood is selling

I love the minimize to tray, too

lol

can I use CSS on form tags like textarea?

there are many freeware utilities that will let you minimize any window to the tray

DARKGirl… we meet again =]

yes

(.. note about logic)

thecks!

SubOne, I forgot to ask about that hover.hta

thecks!

Or what it was.

Oops.. DARKGirl!

I thought it was hover.htc

How should I add it?

shouting to yourself, I see

htc, yes

http://www.xs4all.nl/~peterned/csshover.html

? DARKGirl ?

how that tag is so speccal ?
damn * special

use am IE conditional comment to include an external CSS file that defines the htc file… so you wont lose validation

textarea style="yourstyle"fsdf/textarea

You never answered my question.

textarea.yourstyle { background-color: #000; }

I dont know. I am new to css. wasnt sure you could use it there

yes

DARKGirl, you can use CSS on pretty much any tags

new VS logic

nice

=/

i shall remember that

Is mefisto ignoring the American "idiot"?

!–[if IE 6]?

probably best to use a less than
rather "lte"

Huh?
6

if lte IE 6

Oh

Thats a point, does anybody know if Safari accepts conditional comments like IE does?

does it need to?

One of my sites renders slightly different in Safari
Would be a nice easy fix if it did, but haven't been able to test it
I have to do the same fix for IE
But if I change the part, it breaks in Firefox.. css is such good fun

do a search on the context of your problem with Safari you may find a fix

True

box model hack? holy hack?

That means nothing to me…

or is it holly hack?
nvm

maybe try 'no hacks' ?

SubOne, isn't it just lt?

lt means
lte means =

Hm

less than
less than | equal

you want to apply it to all browsers less than or equal to IE 6

You said lth

did i?

eww

That's what confused me

He said lte :p

if lte IE 6

Oops

if lte IE 6

Shhh

lol

this text is not aligning properly in the textarea gadget
i mean

I'd better open my eyes

…omit gadget
see what you made me say, Thecks!

Lol.. blame me huh? :p
Send me the URL and I'll take a look if you want =]

just add "gadget" to the end of every sentence and we will all think we are crazy

haha

Who here is American?

the url wont work yet

Or rather… everyone post your Country
USA
….denied huh

SubOne got shot down =[

For really realzoid
And I love how Thecks said I got shot down rather than saying his country

It would have taken more effort to say my country

I need to align this http://devhat.pastecode.com/38973

Hmm

Are you allowed to paste small code in here?

It doesnt seem to work in IE.

I'm from the UK =]

it comes out looking ugly

– USA

– DK o.o

I think the rule is something like 3 lines or less is ok

I think you can as long as it doesnt take more than 3 lines

ok SubOne

DK?
Donkey Kong Country?
lol

SubOne, I've added the hover.htc, but it's not working in IE6, yet.

ROFLMAO

Denmark, lol.

denmark

DARKGirl, you mean align it as it is in that textbox?

LMAO

damn I want to live in denmark
or greenland
or iceland

Take Norway instead

aye

DARKGirl, I think they just do it with tab characters :p

did you add the required CSS?

http://juhp.deviantart.com/gallery/ - Checkout norway instead of Denmark.
Yes?

the htc file isnt CSS its a javascript file basically you include it from css

!–[if lte IE 6]style type="text/css"behavior:url("css/hover.htc");/style![endif]–

I dont care where it is as long as it is cold/cool throught the year

well i suppose that works

DARKGirl, come to the UK!

DARKGirl, Norway got the most beautiful nature.

should work… any js errors?

I see none

and it doesnt work?

I have considered moving back to the UK
but that means being closer to family

Nothing when hovering o.o

hmmm
works for me… post it
i mean link

http://juhp.dk/ls/

…I moved to the US to attend college for a reason, you know

ok, so I have classes added to 3 paragraph tags contained in one div
..sidebarlinks .p2{
#9C9C9C;
}
damn

so its done with tabs?

that did not paste right

pastebin o.o

I think so
Yup its done by tabs
So just insert character 9 when ever you want an indent

ok, so I have classes added to 3 paragraph tags contained in one div
..sidebarlinks .p2{background: #9C9C9C;}

Yes?

that is the second paragraph that I would like to turn the background grey
The first and third paragraphs I would like to turn another color (maybe blue)

you have to use a selector X)

Huh?

nappysis, ok so you need another style
..sidebarlinks .p1{background: #0000FF;}
Then paragraph 1 and 3 use p1 and 2 uses p2

right
but that is not working
The paragraphs are contained within a div

and the div is .sidebarlinks?

you can't apply a css rule to nothing

O.o

yes Theaxiom
uh

Have you got div id="sidebarlinks"?

try body {behavior:…}

yes Thecks

Oh.

lol

It should be added to body? xD

yes

Holy..

div class="sidebarlinks"

to it?

yes thats what i said to do lol

Within the if.
Sorry xD

you can put anythign you want in the conditional comment

nappysis, remove the .sidebarlinks part, so its just .p1 and .p2
And see if that works, it may be a div id problem

Do you have time for me yet?

I tried that as well

Hmmm

you still have an ID conflict

I don't like the fact that Notepad2 converts my tabs to doublespace

What are you using to format the text?
p class="p1"?

No I do not

you can set up tabs any way you want

yes

jewelry.neoeliteusa.com

you can set them to any number of spaces you want or set them to just tabs

I might do that.

Line 86, Column 123: ID "extra" already defined.
ID "extra" first defined here.

That's better.

what firefox extension you using? Web Developer isn't giving me these errors.

i just did a validation
http://validator.w3.org/check?verbose=1&uri=http%3A%2F%2Fjewelry.neoeliteusa.com%2F

hey, i'm a newb to html/css/etc and am wondering if 1. someone could recommend a good resource for learning the basics and more advanced stuff and 2. is there an easy way to institute line breaks in a tag without manually doing it?

Web Developer Toolbar doesnt do validation

Omg…
SubOne, check it out, now :/

hmm

thecks, are you still there?

do what now?

If you can.

I dont know how to use bullets in the textarea
oh well
ill omit

We are back to the first problem now.

zomg

The menu goes after the hidelink

in just IE?

Yes

sec

Thecks?

um… is the menu-left-inner set to pos abs?
er maybe float left

to sek

you can do it in just the IE css file

left;

odd

nappysis, yes but I don't know the answer :p

is menu-hide too?

hehe
thanks man

Yup

answer to what

ok, so I have classes added to 3 paragraph tags contained in one div
..sidebarlinks .p2{background: #9C9C9C;}

try putting the div for menu-hide after the other one
so the other one floats left first

Same bug

that is the second paragraph that I would like to turn the background grey

I tried that solution, back when I used JS

The first and third paragraphs I would like to turn another color (maybe blue)

what happens if you remove the menu-hide float?

fixed; __'
Then it's fucked in FF :p
And IE

lol

But the menu works in both
The text is just.. bugged

your server is uber slow

*Hates*
It's my ISP
I can upload what I've got now?

try setting a width for menu-hide now

It's 25px wide
And it's allready set

hrm
sec

And margin:0;padding:0; too

SubOne, I am about to grab some late dinner

k

I'd like to have some food, too :/

But do you understand my situation?

didnt hear the question

:_(

i gotta make kids' food too here soon

what I coded does not work
All I am getting is the body background color instead of the paragraphs background colors

I can't see the problem in the code :/

you have both pos abs and float left on the menuinner
try removing the float

from menu-inner?

menu-left-inner
might have to also add #container #content #menu-left {position:relative;}

I'll try

ok, so I have classes added to 3 paragraph tags contained in one div
..sidebarlinks .p2{background: #9C9C9C;}
that is the second paragraph that I would like to turn the background grey

For the 100th time

The first and third paragraphs I would like to turn another color (maybe blue)
The first and third paragraphs I would like to turn another color (maybe blue)

Hm, the problem is still there :/

nappysis, this is only a temp workaround

i hope this involves more than just bgcolor lol

There everything is valid

In paragraph instead of using classes, do

SubOne, I have a whole page set up at the moment

p style="background: #9C9C9C;"

why dont you link me

And make sure its not a silly error like, forgetting to close a

I will check that Thecks

SubOne, a faster link http://ls.all-scripts.net/

try pos abs on the menu itself

SubOne, it is offline

menu-left?
Well…
We could add the floats

oh first
add the float back in to menu-hide

position:relative;left:-25px; in IE6 only?
Done

work?

Not in IE
FF, yes

in #container #content #menu-left-inner set left:0;top:0;

how do I check if a sting is empty again?

Done

in what language?

i've got a site, looks fine in ffox, looks horrid in IE7… http://serrc.org/drupal/ - can anyone give any tips on WHY?

ack
lol
wrong channel

if (empty($string)) {}

:o

Sorry :p

if you want to know if it is not set you can use !isset()

Multiply.. you can get arrested for giving PHP help in a CSS channel
You crazy?!?!

Cop*
Lol

oh no he started a trend i was corrupted!

!isset?

SubOne.. you'll get off lightly for being a sheep

yay

if (isset($string)) {}

aye

Hey I'm American so you can just ignore me right

But that will return a positive even if the string is empty
That checks to see if its been declared before

so isset wont work?

hmm

Multiply will get fined with being a sheppard
DARKGirl, it depends on what use you want it for

SubOne, couldn't I just make it pos, rel, left-25px in IE?

but empty is normally the way to go

do you want to check for an empty string or a string that was never set?

well I need to make sure the user doesnt leave the username field blank for example

If the string is empty or doesn't exist, it will return true
Yeah, use empty

Then you should use empty

you can try whatever you want at this point lol

no I am processing form data

Lol

so it is all set

How do I make it IE6 only?

if IE 6

Adding the same #container #bla {} into IE
With the same name?

oh
just put the rule in the css file you linked to in the comment conditional

!–[if lte IE 6]link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="css/hover.css" /![endif]–

no other browser uses it

So just… use the same name?

huh?

Erhm

how about if (!$username || preg_match("/guest/i", $username))

brb diaper duty

#container #content #menu-left #menu-left-inner { position: relative; }
Should I just add that to the IE6 css?

Subone wears diapers still? .o
O.o
DARKGirl, whats the significants of preg_match?

supposed to check if the word 'guest' is typed in

Why not #css+php ?
:P

Lol

I am not allowing any user to have the username 'guest'

if (!empty($username) && $username != "guest") {}

Well, I'd probably have different checks for them as its better to return a more helpful error

true

yeah what if my name was "majorguestgatron"?

if (!empty($username)) {

I wish if username =="" would work

It should…

SubOne, it wouldnt be caut
caught*

== is equal too

or you could do strlen()

i know that

1

=== is equal too (case sense)

3

its supposed to check the value inside the variable
not set the value to the variable

how i put style for radio input without ID

DARKGirl, will this also connect to a database?

something like input:radio{}

of course

OH LOL
Hahaha

Then you will also want to sanitise all the data as well

SubOne, I fucked it totally this time xD

I knot what
(that)

you cant unless you use either a selector that is not widely supported or an additional class

$username=mysql_real_escape_string($_POST['username']);
thats the very first thing that happens

I am making a box built by a div inside of a left floated column. I want to float an image right inside the box, but when I try to float it right it floats the image to the right of the column, outside of the box (and below it for that matter) any idea how to fix this?

WOOOW
I got it working.

oki I am going to just try ==""

cool

#container #content #menu-left {position: relative; left: -25px} - to the IE6 :p

lol

:p
Sucky solution
But it works.

DARKGirl, empty is better to use…

Why are we supporting with PHP in here, btw?

Just to let ya know, I fixed at error and it's been uploaded.

you could just make it a bgimage

I said I dont know how to use empty

it's because i've border for input{} but radios effected and i want to exclude it i remember i saw something like input['password']

if (empty($username)) { $errormsg = "Username can not be empty" }

what was itr

eh
thats it?

I thought about that, but the box would grow with the page size and I want to put some borders around the image.

Now.. lol

someone gave me an example earlier and it looked different
oh well
heh

Yup, its just a function that returns true or false if the string is empty =]

there is an attribute selector but its not widely supported

ill use that

Yeah, they combined it with another function

SubOne, http://ls.all-scripts.net/menu.jpg

so there really isn't a way to say "float this thing, but stay within your contained div!"

How do I add those greyed lines?

is the containing div positioned absolutely?

The greyed text* doh.

no, its just a normal div inside of a floated column.

does it have a set width?

http://jewelry.neoeliteusa.com
The float:left error

firfox, safari does not put border for radio's while IE do

like I said it works fine without float:left

thats wierd
chalk it up as a wierd IE issue and try to work around it

sorry didn't see your question, no.. the column nor the div have a set width

wont set one?
link maybe?

I can't work around it… it's the SITE navigation

i know i have the same problem setting a width for my text boxes

link is http://www.sbunn.org/layout.html / http://media.sbunn.org/css/default_layout.css / basestyle.css

there is always a workaround

I guess I could try and add width's, but whenever I try it dorks up my columns.

wait which image
the hippie?

RMS .. yes

in the yelloow box?

What would you suggest for a vertical navigation workaround? I'm stumped…

yes.. well the bg color is just so I could see the box.

hold on im being bombarded

Alright, just don't forget about me

and you want it floated right top aligned?

|| is or right?

yes, to the right of that yellow box

ugh

inside the yellow box to the right I should say

can you move the img in the markup to the top?

I could yes

do that

DARKGirl, yup!

Ok, to the top of what? the div, the floated column, or all the markup

with 2 divs inside, one floats left, the other right. This works fine, but I want the div that holds them to "take space" i.e. to not let other divs be in the same place. I've tried with "clear:both" but it doesn't work. What am I missing?

just to the top of the rest of the content inside its own parent

btw, SubOne, I've added margins to the #text now

If (0 == 0 || 0 != 0) {}
Lets see CSS do that!

done

did that do it?
k cool
ok lemme look at the codezers

yes, it appears it did (the box is too small right now, but that is easy to fix)
I am guessing adding some right margin/padding will give it some breathing room?

Night all!

I don't know what/who is/the codezer so i'll leave you to it

which box is too small?

the yellow box. its just because the text size is too small and I have not finished building the box yet..

oh… its big enough in my FF
but yeah use a clear trick
otherwise the box wont wrap around the floats bottom

cool, thanks. Any reason why moving the image to the top of the div did the trick?

because floating basically "clears" all elements above it that are not floated

ah, ok.
thanks again

np
working on it now

uhm… Maybe my question was badly formulated…
If you want to have 2 things, one aligned left and the other aligned right, but you want them to "take space", what should you do?

i dont know if anyone knows what "take space" means

Hmm :/
I can't get the menu descriptions work as I want.

well, do not allow things are below that part to be in the same place.
I'm sorry, I don't know how to explain it better

why dont you post it somewhere on a server

bphillips (+1)

btw whys the chat title as use 4.01?
whats wrong with xhtml?

well… It's more like a general question, I always have… The page I'm currently working on is really complex to be of any use.

screenshot?

Hi, I have a header defined by a div that I would like to take up 100% of the enclosing div. However, if I add padding to it, its width becomes 100% + the padding size. Therefore giving me a header that is too large. How should I be doing this?
100% is width, by the way

hey guys, i have a question. i was trying to make my layout compatible for all browsers while holding suntax rules but i cant seem to make it FF and IE compatible - take a look http://getgreensnow.net it looks fine in FF but not IE

I don't know if it'd be useful, but here it is: http://www.marga.com.ar/~marga/Pantallazo.png

am i lookign at the pagination numbers?

the Pager is the one bothering me. It's currently a "float:right" span. But, it's going into a second line (I don't know why), and it's not pushing the rest of things down.
yes

how are the status and modified things aligned?

It's a table, just a second

you're floating inside a table cell?

no.
The thing below is a table.
I'm floating inside a div

oh its supposed to be on the same line as "found bugs"?

yes

is found bugs floated?

not currently

thats why

if it were floated, then both of them would be "inside" the table

either float it left or put the pages before it in the markup

Ah! I'll try that

as I stated before… a float sort of "clears" everything above it in the markup that is not also floated
what are you whining about?

I can't get those stupid descriptions to the right :/

that's why I didn't want floats… But, is there a way to obtain the same effect without a float?
It's working now, btw, thanks.

http://ls.all-scripts.net
You see the grey text in the menu?

well you could add another row to the top of the table and colspan those, but dont be lazy

It was supposed to be on the right side, not right after the text

sec
float:right?

Then it disappears :/

Any luck?

no it doesnt

It's not where it's supposed to be.

im still working on it although i must say it is a tricky bugger

Check now

its below that line but you cant see it because you set a height

Should I remove height?

I won't be asking if I could figure it out

i know just be patient plz

I'm not trying to rush you, sorry if I seem that way.

no, you should um…

I'm just getting upset at myself for creating this issue without a way around it…. and Microsoft for creating IE
lol

anyone?

did you not hear what i just told that other guy?

Yes.

you cant float something AFTER a non-floated element and expect it to be on the same line

The thing about it clears the content above?

yeah
so one way would be to wrap the other text in a span too with a class and float it lefgt

So.. basicly, I should remove the float: left; on a?

or move the span to before the other text

Oh.
Two sec

no has nothing to do with the A

Alright so does anyone have any idea while the content doesnt say centered in IE but it does in FF?

Hm
I moved the span before the text.
It did just place it above the text

i think im about to find the problem, one sec

Take your time

and when to use kbd.

hmmm I need some assistance
I need someone to identify a font for me

http://www.identifont.com/
Maybe he can do it?
OCR is amazing. I cannot believe it's existed since the 1950s. It's one of those things I cannot understand even on a theoretical level how they are programmed.

its your content div… sec lemme break it down further

whats the best way to keep something centered - using margins? is that a horizontal align in CSS? positioning? im confuzzled

Well so fat thats a big help

So fat?

you're fat you bastard

xD

Anyone please?

I think it's supposed to be far.

Centered in what direction?

to the center

…

lol
well

Vertically or horizontally?

horizontally

SubOne, I think I tried every of your solutions now.. They don't want to work :/

0 auto 0 auto;

sec phone

(And a width.)

How do I center these squares. http://mickens.us/DELETEME/

text-align

thnx

]]lol

[Google] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LOL_(Internet_slang) (More results: http://tinyurl.com/yrsr3g )

Jams44, that's only for text, if you are using blocks, you may want to use positioning

don't abuse the bot

Sorry.

i have a form which needs two image submit buttons… when the form is submitted it should have 1 value yes or no… but ie7 seems to only submit name.x and name.y for the button that was clicked, and not the value?

use the margin: auto;

I did
It seems to work if I set a width, but I don't want to do that

and the same again but value no… is that wrong?

sorry I can't help you then… i was ALWAYS under the impression you HAD to

_ jesus, I hate css more and more every day
thanks Daveman

I love it more n' more.

er, DaveTheAve
Multiply, why, all of the rules only work under certain conditions in certain browsers if you cross your fingers _

identifont didnt work

Anyone know why http://getgreensnow.net is compatible with FF and not IE - i cnat seem to get it to work in IE

jimmygoon, hacks

Is there somewhere else to validate css aside from jigsaw?

Is jigsaw down again?

yeah.

Multiply, or use a language that is actually reasonable and follows its own "rules"… java and c++ _work_

@http://getgreensnow.net

http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fgetgreensnow.net&charset=%28detect+automatically%29&doctype=Inline&group=0

anyway, I'm trolling so I'll leave. thanks for the help

(getgreensnow….) HTML: Failed (59 errors, see http://tinyurl.com/yr3lwz ) | CSS: Failed (16 errors, see http://tinyurl.com/2pv2ll ) [102 warnings] | DOCTYPE: XHTML 1.0 Trans + url | (MIME: text/html, text/html;
charset=ISO-8859-1)

@http://juhp.dk/ls/

Fix your code.

(juhp.dk/ls/) HTML: Valid ( http://tinyurl.com/yp28xz ) | CSS: Valid [2 warnings] ( http://tinyurl.com/3ygq8x ) | DOCTYPE: XHTML 1.0 Strict + url | (MIME: text/html, text/html;charset=iso-8859-1)

2 CSS warnings
Might be colors

somehow the margin on your content element is being rendered like a sheet of impenetrable glass in IE so replace margin-left: 210px; with float: left; for #content

Yup, it is.

@www.arcsupport.ca/blog

Attacus_:tons of those are for missing alts which at the moment are top priority, im trying to get this thing centered in IE. i know i seem like a porcrastinator but it seems all else comes after this problem

(arcsupport.ca/bl…) HTML: Valid ( http://tinyurl.com/ys6xjw ) | Network error ( http://tinyurl.com/2nfnov ) | DOCTYPE: Network Error | (MIME: Error)

LOVE the simile, but i'll try that… Thank for your help

can anyone tell me what font it is thats used in the menubar of this template? It seems a fairly common font
http://decepticons.deviantart.com/art/SIMPLE-3818050

np

Ok, i need a little help with form styling on a new homepage im working on. http://maximhosting.com/new/

If even one of those is not a missing alt, it could potentially be the problem.

@http://juhp.dk/ls/
Should be Valid in both, now.

alright ill take a look

(juhp.dk/ls/) HTML: Valid ( http://tinyurl.com/yp28xz ) | CSS: Valid ( http://tinyurl.com/3ygq8x ) | DOCTYPE: XHTML 1.0 Strict + url | (MIME: text/html, text/html;charset=iso-8859-1)

If you look at the dropdown in FF, its all squished and isnt the same height as the text input beside it

Yay.

@http://subonedesign.com/

(subonedesign….) HTML: Valid ( http://tinyurl.com/38cj2a ) | CSS: Valid [129 warnings] ( http://tinyurl.com/yqkvzm ) | DOCTYPE: HTML 4.01 Strict + url | (MIME: text/html;charset=UTF-8)

Anyone know why I get a timeout trying to validate www.arcsupport.ca/blog ?

Damn o.o

can i select all ids that start with a prefix

dancor, select?

with a selector

@http://www.arcsupport.ca/blog/

(www.arcsuppor…) HTML: Valid ( http://tinyurl.com/2zfmfe ) | Network error ( http://tinyurl.com/2q6wlv ) | DOCTYPE: HTML 4.01 Strict + url | (MIME: text/html, text/html; charset=utf-8)

Why's the mime "text/html, text/html;"?
Is it because the servers says, in the header, and theres a meta-tag?

So, how do I center these vertically? @http://mickens.us/DELETEME http://mickens.us/DELETEME (link twice so the second one is friendly w/ xchat)
@http://mickens.us/DELETEME

(mickens.us/DE…) HTML: Valid ( http://tinyurl.com/2bvg7j ) | CSS: Valid [5 warnings] ( http://tinyurl.com/3786cz ) | DOCTYPE: XHTML 1.0 Trans + url | (MIME: text/html, text/html; charset=utf-8)

could be because you have html tags in your css document

!– does not belong in a css file

nor does it make any sense

never midn, my container is a set size and so are the buttons so I got it

@http://www.newmediaadvisorsllc.com

I forgot to remove it when i was testing earlier

(www.newmediaa…) HTML: Failed (11 errors, see http://tinyurl.com/2wo5tq ) | CSS: Valid [11 warnings] ( http://tinyurl.com/yvxuss ) | DOCTYPE: HTML 4.01 Trans + url | (MIME: text/html, text/html;
charset=iso-8859-1)

well i guess im off for now… i gotta go make dinner for the children and then go get high and do stupid stuff, because I'm an American and apparently we are all idots….

Works now, thanks for catching that Subone.

later guys

Night

If nobody said bye to me i'd be mad lol
laterz

@www.arcsupport.ca/blog

(arcsupport.ca/bl…) HTML: Valid ( http://tinyurl.com/ys6xjw ) | CSS: Valid [10 warnings] ( http://tinyurl.com/2nfnov ) | DOCTYPE: Network Error | (MIME: Error)

Yeah, I might go to bed now, too.

@http://maximhosting.com/new/

(maximhosting….) HTML: Valid ( http://tinyurl.com/2pjumk ) | CSS: Valid [95 warnings] ( http://tinyurl.com/2zhglc ) | DOCTYPE: XHTML 1.0 Strict + url | (MIME: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1, text/html;
charset=ISO-8859-1)

Hmm, odd, w3c validator doesnt show any warnings with my css
Er, guess it does
Im blind

Good job, MACscr
Sleep well.

can you help my with my form issue on that page?

is it possible to make a block-level element right aligned?
let's say it's a search bar

how i make horizontal aligned ul's
not the list elements but the list it self
done. i made float:left; np

Lol, yep, duh =P

yeah
what happens when you make them inline?

inline dose not effect
does*

oDesk, oh wait you have several lists you have horizontally aligned?

yes

ah okay

aligned with them

I know that Thecks was helping me with this earlier, but I can't get anything to work

not help

]aksjf

ok now i know way
sorry why*

I placed 3 paragraphs with classes inside of a div with a class
I want to make the backgrounds of those 3 paragraphs different than the body background
But the background of the 3 paragraphs will NOT change
They stay the color of the body
what I am doing wrong?

Show us code. Since, we can't tell what you're doing wrong.

.sidebarlinks .p1{background: #009CFF;}

Force-LoopBreak option. Can i safely do it?

!e2fsprogs

methinks e2fsprogs is if you are getting a messages about Force LoopBreak a likely cause is that you are trying to upgrade pre-stable packages to testing which isnt' supported. you should fully upgrade to the current stable before upgrading to testing,ask me about force loopbreak

!e2fsprogs loop

for instruction on upgrading to etch

oh
thanks

Which package would have convert in it? The image manipulation cli tool?

Is there a module I should have loaded?

I downloaded debian-testing-i386-CD-1.iso , and burned it. But I couldn't boot from it.. Wrong image?

imagemagick

thanks

!tell hesco about search

how is your BIOS set? Does it permit a boot from CD?

Yes

any error messages?

It's on a thinkpad, press f12 and boot..

that is a correct image

No errors

your drive can read cd-rs?

then suspect the way you burnt it

so what happens?

Yes, I have booted BSD from RW cd's
Well.. nothing happend. It started to spinn up, and jumped to hd

has this install media been successfully used on any other machine recently?

No, I will have try it on another machine. I just wanted to know if it was the correct image

should i reboot after i upgrade to sarge, or can i safely upgrade to etch imidietly?

hi, which driver should install to get logitech chat webcam working?

That sounds like perhaps it failed to find bootable partition on CD.

are you running on a 2.6 kernel now?

themill, no, its 2.4

yeah, and i did finalize the burn.. Just to be shure

and its a remote host, so if i fsck up its bad

I think you need to be running a 2.6 kernel before upgrading to etch.

frog, depends on the model

themill, oh, are you sure? thanks for the info

logitech QuickCam chat

Is there a testing publish your images online for pxeboot?

frog, either gspcav1 or uvcvideo

i must compile hosting it on my won, isnt ok?

frog, gspcavi1 can be compiled with m-a IIRC

m-a?

!m-a

well, module-assistant is a tool helping to build additional (kernel) module packages and generate/install DEB packages with them, or aptitude install module-assistant build-essential && m-a prepare

ok

there are, check the install guide under install media

you know the pacckage name?

for what?

for gspcavi1

frog, gspcav1- my typing error
frog, i think it's listed in m-a

ok, so i guess its not im my sources

frog, else it uses the old spcaxxx driver

what's the ocmmand to check what HD are on my computer ?
fdisk -l doens't work on a debian

!doesn't work

Look buddy, "doesn't work" is an ambiguous statement. Does it sit on the couch all day long? Does it procrastinate doing the dishes? Does it beg on the street for change? Please be specific! Define 'it' and what it isn't doing. Give us more details so we can help you without needing to ask basic questions like "what's the error message".

it won't take the garbage out

works for me… what's your problem

any idea where to get the kernel sources for 2.6.22-1-686?

you know the source for this gspcav1 or spcaxxx?

10 bucks on "command not found", 5 on non-root usage

looks like su helps sometime..
anyway how can I format disk into ext3 ?
/dev/hdd1 1 4998 40146403+ 83 Linux

frog, m-a doesn't offer you the option?

no

this is my HD that Iwanna to be mount ona /media

not going to take those sorts of odds….

yay! I win

frog, what version of debian ?

sid

frog, hang on

ok

mkfs.ext3 /dev/hdd1 (this may eat your data, if you don't know what you are doing)

frog, gspca turns up here - run m-a prepare first

after that, edit /etc/fstab

ok, thx cahoot

who?

preparing for pirate day?

a character in 1st season of ST:TNG, had sex with Data.

arr!

jelly-home: tasha yar

what's the default kernel for etch 2.6.8?

jelly-home: oh… nevermind
no, 2.6.18

local accent around here is amazing. Genuine pirate. They pronouce the r at the end of car: car-rrr.

themill sweet i live in parkland manitoba canada

default and only one afaik

hmpf. do can i get that one?

?

hehe

apt-get install it

eh, how can i get that one?

unless there's any caveats… not sure

themill, just like here then

what's your CPU ?

i wonter if when i get my net suff if themill wil be hideing under pc desk

amd64.k8.smp

where are you? Penzance or something?

themill, no se

apt-cache search linux-image k7 .. or k8

i just did a dist-upgrade and was suspecting to get the latest kernel as well

k7 is 32bit .. k8 is 64bit
or just apt-cache search linux-image to see them all

where is penzance?

italy ?
no .. wait .. nevermind

just near a place called Land's End. (no really)… http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=penzance&f=q&hl=en&sll=&sspn=&ie=UTF8&ll=51.144894,-2.988281&spn=3.935631,7.382813&z=7&om=1

doesn't sound italian

cornwall

as in "pirates of penzance"…. G&S

ya, i know thephrase, just never realised there was an actual place

still stuck on 2.6.8

G&S "pirates" and the west country accent and the stereotypical "arrrr" aren't a coincidence.

apt-cache search linux-image shows you nothing ?

http://www.worldofmi.com/features/lyrics/A%20pirate%20I%20was%20meant%20to%20be.mp3

G&S?

linux-image-2.6-amd64-k8-smp will install 2.6.8
how do i see whether dist-upgrade suceeded?

and your sources list is pointed to?

Hi

oh .. don't use the -smp

I got some bad blocks in mh hdd

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilbert_and_Sullivan

how can I mark them
I using resierfs

etch

backblocks

bad?

I mean bad secotrs

otherwise the rest of the whole dis-tupgrade stuff wouldnt have gone thru…

yeah

why shouldnt i?

install linux-image-2.6-amd64
all etch kernels are SMP now

anirban, you plan to keep using it?

yeah
At least for some days

ah

cause I am having problem only to mount a particular partition

wow, reiserfs AND bad blocks. You hate your data?

\/dev/sda9 is my root

hm, all i get is that lousy 2.6.8 one.

install linux-image-2.6-amd64 .. with that ?

yes

paste your sources somewhere
!paste

Please do not paste anything at all to this channel. Instead, use: http://channels.debian.net/paste/ or http://rafb.net/paste/ or http://picpaste.com for pics.

I tired to rebuild-tree but it fail
saying that can not read the hdd
but then my qns is how come other partitions are readble

http://rafb.net/p/R898aZ73.html

in gnome, where are things like resolution and screensaver settings stored on the filesystem?

gnome conroal

resolution is in xorg.conf but randr can switch between your defined settings.
look in gnome-control-center.

themill what u burn with?

(which is probably on the system menu somewhere but I don't use gnome so I don't know where)
k3b

thats really cool one

gnome or gdm seems to be doing something because I changed my resolution and xorg.conf was not changed

run the command xrandr from a terminal and see what it shows. It might be that X didn't like your change so ignored it.
you did restart X after changing the config file, didn't you?

I'm talking about using gnome to change the resolution, that doesn't affect xorg.conf nor does it need to manually restart X

hi there what is wrong with this /etc/apt/preferences? I want to pin grater priority to this repository: deb http://192.168.4.1/local/ ./ but apt-cache polity keep telling me that both them has priority 500, any tips? man apt_preferences do not tell me about the syntax.

what does "i A" in aptitude mean?

aha, found it for the resolution: ~/.gconf/desktop/gnome/screen/default/0/%gconf.xml

(my file) http://paste.debian.net/34695

gnome can use this xrandr mechanism to select between settings that are already in your xorg.conf. They only apply to the current login unless you get gnome to persist them between logins, in which case they still wouldn't apply to gdm

I read that minimum disk usage is 5Gig.. But does a desktop system use that much?

leafwiz, it depends on what you are doing with the sytem

you could install in less space, obviously it depends which packages you install

yeah, I want to install it as a desktop system

my debian xen guests only use about 100mb
err i take that back about 500m

mm..
same as my obsd system

mind you that's a pretty base install ( the template is built up from a debootstrap then kept uptodate with apt-get )

I hoped to install beryll

i use obsd in my firewalls debian on my application servers and solaris in my storage

the 2.6.18 kernels are marked with "i A" in aptitude..

is it possible to run slackware on debian etch as a guest xen OS ?

yes

Oh.. Solaris. Is it good?

you know that you are in a debian channel, right?

If my monitor is blanking with 'out of range' then I need to change my xorg.conf to specify its refresh rate better?

installed, automatically (ie, installed as a depends of the meta package)

yes

Yeah.. But FuzzyB said he used Solais on his fileserver. And I wonder what it's strengths where

zfs

!solaris

Learning solaris is like anally raping myself with a big red fire truck., or ask me about solaris source, or pretty much okay on x86, or shit. slowlaris, or http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=152676&cid=12814224
Learning solaris is like anally raping myself with a big red fire truck., or ask me about solaris source, or pretty much okay on x86, or shit. slowlaris, or a href="http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=152676&cid=12814224"http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=152676&cid=12814224/a

ignore the fud
go read about zfs
i won't say another word

zfs works on more than solaris

i wouldn't trust it

*curious*

and it's she thank you very much
go ask in #solaris
if you want to know about solaris

i want to change the hostname in debian, how do i do it?

i know about solaris
!hostname

to set the hostname, $EDITOR /etc/hostname to set it for the next boot, and $EDITOR /etc/hosts to set the FQDN, or create /etc/hostname if it doesn't exist, or 'man 1 hostname'

that wasn't to you

oh

:]

aren't the Sun/OpenSOlaris engineers the ones porting zfs to Fuse and *bsd ?

ya
and zfs is showing up in os/x

so you don't trust them ?

supposedly in the next release
no i don't trust the 3rd part zfs hack that linux is trying to use
s/part/party/

linux uses fuse .. sun engineers are porting zfs to fuse .. you trust sun engineers

yes i trust fuse, but it was my understanding that someone outside of sun was writing zfs for linux

i just asked you and you said they were!

i think you misunderstand me
i don't have a problem with fuse

aren't the Sun/OpenSOlaris engineers the ones porting zfs to Fuse and *bsd ?

you said ya!

yes
to bsd that is
sorry i didn't see that fuse part
http://www.wizy.org/wiki/ZFS_on_FUSE

wrong about what?

sun is writing the fuse module for linux

oh .. sponsored by google ?

i didn't think they were the ones doing it
yea supposedly
i dunno my mind is in other places

wtf .. BloggerFS is a filesystem that allow Blogger users to manipulate posts on their blogs via a file interface.

Writing inode tables: 55/307

oh .. i misread that
has it moved in awhile ?

it's crazy what you can do with fuse. If you know perl they have a fuse module that might be of interest

it was moving untull table 55

fuse really is taking the "everything is a file" and "everything is a filesystem" philosophies to the extreme….

true, but it's really cool to make a virt filesystem that is backed by some custom database stuff
pair fuse with a mysql cluster and you have some interesting possibilities

if i have a debian box with a custom kernel, how would you revert back to the debian packaged generic kernel?

just install it.

install it
too slow

not just install it, … install and reboot!

and/or fix grub accordingly

hi, any boddy knows howto modify things on "Storage devices" in the konkeror
or how to make that the udev show only partitions tht I want

Hey guys, I had to skip the package selection bit in the installation, how would I grab the same packages as "desktop/standard enviroment" now?

run tasksel

K, tasksel keep stalling on me.

any error messages?

ok… on the debian documentations pages ther is not information on how to modifi the udev
and the only "readme" of udev with some info is a mess … where can i find good documentation??

themill, Not that I can see, it just says Please wait and won't move.

is there such a package as ffmpeg-php?

w00t?

lewis222, not in debian.

okay im trying to install php4-mysql on debian sarge, http://pastebin.ca/658328 any ideas?

Brb

http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/utils/kernel/hotplug/udev.html — (googled "udev")

you have nasty third-party repositories in your /etc/apt/sources.list. Get rid of them.

ok so any boddy on this channel knows nothig of udev??

udev is work of the devil.

!jelly-home++

udev is quite good now

jelly-home, you are rigth

even if it is still voodoo

then why is the same bug still there

jelly-home, this is my source.list http://pastebin.ca/658338

In my defense, I've just finished a House, M.D. marathon and am feeling somewhat bitchy

Compared with devfs or static device nodes, I agree.

could i install a 686 kernel for a AMD Barton 3000+ chip?

there were some thrid party reppositories however i commented them all

no that's for intel

yes, that is your sources.list now. But you've got php stuff installed from the dotdeb repos still

get the -k7 or so

what is the acutual update-modules force ?

yes i know, but there are no xen k7 kernels

update-modules is deprecated

the udev show me things that i do not need to seee damm udev

themill, oh

yes i see, that why i ask

pastebin dpkg -l "php4*" |grep ^.i to confirm

no idea

its not my server im just upgrading it so everythign is possible

well, the owner has been using dotdeb packages. Anything is possible.

ii php4 4.1.2-7.0.1 A server-side, HTML-embedded scripting langu ii php4-common 4.4.7-0.dotdeb Common files for packages built from the php

chi sa cosa significa il *121* prima di un numero? sono da scheda vodafone :E

"pastebin" != "paste here on the channel"

!info linux-image-2.6.22-1-vserver-k7

linux-image-2.6.22-1-vserver-k7: (Linux 2.6.22 image on AMD K7), section admin, is optional. Version: 2.6.22-3 (sid), Packaged size: 18008 kB, Installed size: 52672 kB

well its only two lines

…. a nice mix of dotdeb and woody.

no more xen names in sid
i know nothing though

I'd purge them both, then reinstall.

okay i'll try

why is it that backports.org seems to produce packages that usually work without any problems but dotdeb seems to cause problems?
you might like to back up your config files before purging

make sure you have a backup of php services configuration before purging

oops themill
sorry
(amsg)
:/

hello, does anyone know, which option in the kernel is responsible for the auto-recognition of usb stick, because after i compiled the kernel, my usb stick can not be automaticly recognized.

themill, It's not moving but I'll give it the benefit of the doubt and leave it open.

well i do have it alredy

http://packages.debian.org/testing/source/ffmpeg-php - nothing in stable?

no problem. My Italian is a little rusty so I wasn't sure if you were channel spamming or just a little lost and looking for debian help

!search

to find factoids containing thing. see http://wiki.debian.org/WhereIsIt

Is there a way to find out what packages tasksel would've installed for a selected task?

!tell lewis222 -about simple sid backport

look through /usr/share/tasksel/debian-tasks.desc

die tasksel die

also look in /usr/share/doc/tasksel/README.gz for a description of that file

it seems to work fine thanks!

whoah, jetscreamer telling tasksel to die? has hell frozen over?

that's a secret

doh me

i've always not liked tasksels selections.. the laptop one seems ok

confused tasksel with with that other horrible package manager thing

ahhh

selecting nothing in tasksel always seems to be the safe option

dselect is your god, yes

!kill dselect

if dselect had a collapsible tree the world would still be using dselect

pours salt iin wounds

in the selecton menu i mean

can anyone confirm that etch doesn't work with 2.4 kernels?

no, seeing as it still has the option to install with one

udev doesn't

How can I make 'apt-get' give me the progress in percentage when I pipe it to another program?

udev!=debian

oh

i was just saying

so i'll have to stay with sarge

i was actually typing out that disclaimer when you replied

it might .. but it's a bad idea

hi

i see

i wonder if it's the 2.4 or the udev that won't play nice with etch or lenny

im not going to check

hi

me neither

I have a mountpoint which I want to be writable to all users… what should I add to the options? (if it is mounted at boot)

man mount, search umask , uid, gid … fmask & dmask if vfat or ntfs

it is xfs
and I read man mount

theres something to do with glibc that needs a kernel greater than 2.6.8

fix the mount point

in what way?

i think that's only in newer libc than etch has

http://ircgeeks.net/~micke/desk_infnix.png, /me happy… :]

i think you're right

you could just chown -R /mountpoint

Is there a way that works , to stream content over smb from a samba server? Using gnome?

so the perms are correct

or whatever

where does gnome come into it?

smb://servername

allrighty. Something is seriously wrong. I've beeing tryed to format hdd1 with commadn: mkfs.ext3 /dev/hdd1 but everything's stoped at the table 55: Writing inode tables: 55/307 What do u suggest ??

that's not a stream

there should be a gnome-vfs or nautilis-vfs library that handles that

how long have you waited?

when you watch a movie from that share, there's a stream

jelly-home: a bout 30 min

HOW do I fix it? what do I need to do so the perms are correct?

but has nothing to do with "streaming over smb"

anything funny in dmesg or /var/log/kern.log?

okay, i'll check it out

probably like all your other mount points

error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/x11proto-core-dev_7.0.10-2_all.deb (–unpack):

That isn't an error, post the whole output to paster.

wtf

you're smart

beyond your comprehension

lol

…. all my other mount points are that way as well

which filesystem are you using?

don't dpkg -i –force-overwrite /var/cache/apt/archives/x11proto-core-dev_7.0.10-2_all.deb whatever you do

any way to know which repository was used to download a particular .deb when the package was installed ?

I am not
this is lenny btw

jetscreamer:xfs

that was a joke
try it

should I ?

chmod/chown /mountpoint
what is the error
not overwriting?

will it break anything ? I know it's only saying a missing newline..
but it could mean a corrupt archive
oh
my paste didn't include the error
one second

well it's a judgement call… if it's just trying to overwrite something supplied by another package, usually np. what you say.. maybe p

what is a .tbz2 file?

I don't wan't to chown it… and chmodding does nothing

k

hi

http://paste.debian.net/34703
there

tar.bz2

a result of someone being too lazy to type .tar.bz2?

how can I remove a hidden truecrypt partition? unlike a container there is no file that can be simply removed

what's my name?

bitch

What they said, 'file somefile.tbz2' will also tell you.

Unknown

you might want to edit the unpacked file and add that newline, the force would probably mess up

you're crusin' for a brusin'!

Bitchslap him.

i'll have to guess anthony, antgel_
was i close?

nm, got it to work… I had some bad options in fstab

can i stream over nat?

thanks

what's close? i can't be bothered to google it

can i phone a friend?

so your name is not anthony then

you have one lifeline left

lies

Filthy ones?

hello, is there anyone can help me

jetscreamer, which file is the list ?

only if you tell us the problem

Ask and we will see.

and even then, maybe not

I haven't been in the 'editing a .deb' section

kisi:change starts from within
wow, it's like i hit you all with the sarcasm stick

or the surgeons table

not sure, it's somewhere under /var/cache i 'think'

I bet everyong else has been watching House too.

I have opened the .deb file

what is the best way to install unstable? testing/stable netinstall cd and then an update with a modified sourcelist?

no DustyBin
changes sources.list is all

what else?

sources.list ?

apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade … make that aptitude

oh

yep, in fact the stable installer will let you choose unstable if you're in EXPERT mode

nvr mind

ah, ok
because i don't want to download unecessary old stuff

Hi All. I should be able to 1. install debian without a swap partition to avoid swapping to disk, 2. remove gnome/kde and configure icewm.. correct?

i think you want to edit the already extracted file, but i'm not sure.. think i did something like that a year ago

my wireless cards is prism 2.5, installed in kernel , but now sometimes it would loss package ,ex now

or just put it on hold till they fix the package
check bdo

oh yeah. have it your way

!bdo

i heard bdo is ask my about btsalso http://backports.debian.org ask me about backports

err
!bts

hmm… bts is the Bug Tracking System for Debian packages, http://bugs.debian.org/ or to go directly to the bug page for a particular package/bug, try http://bugs.debian.org/packagename or http://bugs.debian.org/bugnumber apt-get install reportbug, and check out querybts too. Unstable users are required to check the BTS, useful for sid: apt-get install apt-listbugs, or apt-get install apt-listchanges

not having a swap partition is *not* going to stop the os swapping
bnot having a swap partition is *not* going to stop the os swapping/b

can I specify icewm during the install?

the installer forces you to make a swap area i believe , tho you can perhaps bypass this in expert install

uh, yes it is?

well, it will, because it wont get the chance and will just crash instead

just install the standard system then install icewm

ok thanks jetscreamer

and btw you are not forced to install a full DE. do a minimal install then icewm

take all the marks off in tasksel when installing, apt0get install icewm icewm-themes xorg when done

I will try to get this working first though
it's quite important

So I guess debian isnt the distro for me if I have limited memory and cant use swap…?

use a swap file
you don't '

jelly-home: what happens when it runs out of memory then?

have' to use a partition

Kernel's OOM killer!

Not really try a uclibc based system

enter the OOM Killer! reap it down!

I want to install Debina on a CF card.. cant have swap

it's teh win, I hear

!tell uptownben about dsl

Debina sounds extra-feminine

debootstrap

no it doesn't, because i knew a larger chick named regina

if you dont have swap, you need make system to dont need much memory

and btw I wouldn't install there directly, the less RW you do on the card the better it is

http://backports.debian.org/, Server not found
everything stopped working on me today

install using debbootstrap and try flashhybrid package

jelly-home: interesting, first time i've learnt something here in ages. you win a half chewed gummy bear!

sorry - what happened to the bunzip package?

that's because it's called "backports.org"

that's correct… are you looking for backports.org? or bugs.debian.org?

but we were all here when you learned that your girlfriend thought you were fat & ugly…
ubut we were all here when you learned that your girlfriend thought you were fat & ugly…/u
ubut we were all here when you learned that your girlfriend thought you were fat & ugly…/u

DSL is 2.4, I want 2.6

i heard bdo is ask my about btsalso http://backports.debian.org ask me about backports

I think you lost me on that one, sleek

might want to correct that

which flavor?

!bts

bts is, like, the Bug Tracking System for Debian packages, http://bugs.debian.org/ or to go directly to the bug page for a particular package/bug, try http://bugs.debian.org/packagename or http://bugs.debian.org/bugnumber apt-get install reportbug, and check out querybts too. Unstable users are required to check the BTS, useful for sid: apt-get install apt-listbugs, or apt-get install apt-listchanges

what do you have to suggest for an issue tracking application to be installed on a Debian system ?

then get something other than DSL

The ask my part?

shut up dpkg you retarded misinforming bot

how can i make ssh server use port 80 instead of 22?

!tell disposable about polls

jelly-home: latex

doh

!kill sleek

AAAHH

!tell DimGR_lap about polls

by editing the fine configuration file in /etc/ssh/sshd_config

change the Port setting in sshd_confi
sshd_config anyway

you know what you doing

wtf is that

for backports ask me about backports; for bugs ask me about bts

okay, themill

antgel, wtf?

jelly-home: not all all

Braindead, Gathond, thank you

yeah it was meant for DimGR_lap

move zig.

jelly-home: U asked before what went wrong when I tryed to format the disk… here is the dmesg: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/33842/

!tell frojnd about u

hehe, goes to the expense of capitalising U!

i say we update debhelper to kick those who use txt talk

dutch

ok. so if i type the word you 50billion times, and the letter u 50 billion times, what do you suppose the savings, in minutes, is?

pls don't…

no, you pay!

dutch people tend to speak better english than english people, ime

i love dutch girls accent when they speak engrish

s,english,american,

its way sexy

bad cabling or a bad block on the disk

you including canadian in american?

jelly-home: how can I format disk than :s

it's a bad disk, don't put data on it

dd the hd/partition first? then create?

dunno, i was thinking of bad english, and american came to mind

i hear they love an outback aussie accent!
no drongo, cobber!

i've had a couple 'errors' that fixed

oi, fair dinkum? thats bonza!

hehe

siol.net sounds Slovenian to me.

knchwa

napisan

kwe kwe

kurwa

that's Slovakian

where does this cobber thing come from? The poms keep on saying "cobber" to me as if I understand it, but I've never heard it in Australia.

(sp?)

is it ?

dunno, looks Polish

it's polish

really? you come from sydney or something?

I thought it's polack ( or polish… from poland )

dunno cobber, must be something wrong with my drongo. who cut the dog in half anyway?

yes… and melbourne

If you really want to use that disk, look up badblocks

lots of Polish came to play Trem servers and ruined the game by spamming kurwas

is that the posh bit?

* in Trem

well, compared to Perth…

is perth where the unsavoury types live?

i am a recent immigrant to perth

maps.google.com

oh yeah….. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bogan

i know the geography for the most part, i mean more the aussie words

sort of like an aussie chav?

d'oh was going so well for a sec
yeah… sort of

hello, from mysql database services command line how can I show all the users? (something llike show databases

jelly-home: so my disk is scrapped? how can I look up badblocks

just ditch it

aw, i dunno if i'd compare a bogan to a chav

me heard em lassies from aussies are not that bad too
:d

use mysql; select * from users

bogans are just losers, whereas chavs appears to be active wankers

have you looked this topic up in the MYSQL FRICKING MANUAL where its blatantly presented?

sheilas, get it right

antgel http://www.google.com.mx/search?hl=es&q=mysql+query+users&btnG=Buscar&meta=

or use phpmyadmin… it's just easier

so what?
there is a mysql manual. why not read it before trying random web searches

themill, aye - but me though aussie is a brit place

the mysql docs are quite extensive too

okay, i want to print after login information about how many users are logged in im using who|wc -l

so lassies instead of sheilas

antgel how can I know the users from my php mysql web hosting server?

where shoudl i put shuch a script?

and pricillas

"tar -cf file.tar /my_folder" ….. but : excluding files biggers to 1MB ?

:d

Try doing some SMART tests with smartctl (smartmontools package). If you really want to use the disk, man badblocks, man mke2fs.

themill I wanna know the mysql users from my server

this feels like groundhog day

how can I add a directory full of .debs to my apt sources list

I don't know whats groundhog

man sources.list
i am /not/ surprised

kenji, show processlist
will show u all active connections to ur mysl server

tnks aadil

np

not a bad chav/bogan comparison. I'd been struggling to describe it.

jelly-home: this dmesh output that I just ran, it allso appears during the sturt up of computer…

no no aadil I wanna know all the users of my mysql server

thanks

man sources.list has a howto on creating a local repo?

kenji, select * from mysql.users;

so the disk is bad from before, OR it might be the cables. Check/replace them.

aadil I don't have a users DB

"tar -cf file.tar /my_folder" ….. but : excluding files biggers to 1MB ?

then oops?
:d

jelly-home: ok tnx

jelly-home: no, it should say how to add one though

aadil how can I list all the users on mysql?

kenji, with the last command i gave u

yes you do, it's in 'mysql'

install phpmyadmin and use that interface, it's easier

are you using debian?

the same command others gave u too
:d

themill I can't use phpmyadmin don't give me friki solutions
antgel I have debian yes

you really think a user who knows how to set up a repo doesn't know how to configure apt to use it?

why not?

aren't you feeling bitchy today

themill because its a virtual enviroment just for mysql

at the command line, it's the user table not users

simonrvn I don't have users database because I ran the mysql_secure_installation script

Packages.gz; then add "deb file:/where/your/debs/are ./" to your sources.list

go browse the mysql table

how can I list all the mysql users from mysql command line?

we should all leave linux and use windows instead
it uses mv instead of move !

use mysql; select * from user;

jelly-home: thanks a lot.. that was very helpful..

there's not much more we can tell you.

themill that work tnks

because there's not much more you need to do to find out

for more info /msg dpkg repository

themill told you that 5 min ago….

/msg dpkg suppository

suppose this

connect to address 66……..201 port 22: Connection timed out), but i can make the same connection from elsewhere (debug1: Connection established.). i already restarted my sshd. what else would you guys look into?

iptables -L ? /etc/hosts.{allow,deny}

firewall at your work forbids outgoing ssh?

"tar -cf file.tar /my_folder" ….. but : excluding files biggers to 1MB ?

themill, no iptables in use. /etc/hosts.deny does contain "ALL: PARANOID" - not sure what this means.

!tell ramiro -about repeat

paranoid is extra anal

jelly-home, i checked with the net-ops team and they don't filter any outgoing traffic.

yeh, .fr.debian is slow as molasses….

jetscreamer, i.e. possibly blocking these sessions?

i forget, but it's in the manpage iirc
but i think so

can you confirm this with eg. "tcptraceroute home-ip 22"?

thanks

do a select * from user; on the mysql table

FuzzyB very late

jelly-home, good idea.

FuzzyB try next time

dude, your like, lagging rly bad, lol

joy

ok, time to put brain back in enclosure

you can use find to display all the filenames matching, redirect that output into a file, then tell tar to only archive the names from that file.

hmmm

jelly-home, there appears to be no (tcp)traceroute on that machine. bah!

sounds interesting, i will tray that

even windows has a livecd… debian doesn't

yes it does
!debian live

i am wondering if the PARANOID record matches here "any host whose name does not match its address."

meh
!debianlive

yeah i know, but it's not official or done or released yet eh?

bah humbug

it does check both forward and reverse DNS AFAIR

i think its actually official now, though not positive on that one

jelly-home, so likely an IP address change in the office network means that it now matches this rule!@

hell even ubuntu has one

but you wouldn't get a timed out connection if it was tcp_wrappers stopping you

and they had been making such changes
hosts.deny is a simple security mechanism, right? removing the ALL:PARANOID is just going to mean more possible machines can reach mine, i take it

right

OK, i shall try to forge an allow rule for this
thank you for the help, jelly-home!
you too, themill, jetscreamer

i didn't do it i know nothing!

however if it were /etc/hosts.deny stopping, you would be able to establish a tcp connection
do you have something like fail2ban or some iptables-based protection from brute-force ssh attacks?

jetscreamer, it was my mistake
bad shutdown earlier

it won't block you from making 1 or 2 conn's at once. if you're sending a whole bunch of packets at once, yes it will

the .list in /var/lib/dpkg/info got corrupted

jelly-home, the only protection i know of is the port filtering on my WRT54G
yeah, still timing out…. shit

!congratulate sleek

Nice one sleek, you did it!

heh double entendre

I shoud restart and run fsck

hello

later

if it's not / no need, just umount

touch /forcefsck

it is

how can i install a package for sid under my etch with not a lot of problems ?

what he said, which is what shutdown -Fr now does i think

no way.

jelly-home: yup

!bdo

for backports ask me about backports; for bugs ask me about bts

jelly-home: serious ?

lol

^^^

use backports instead

ok

if there is not backport, you can try doing it yourself. /msg dpkg simple sid backport … the procedure may fail more often than not

How do I install ncurses with apt-get?

I fixed up that bdo factoid earlier today as it was talking rubbish and had dead URLs in it.

apt-get install ncurses didn't work.

jelly-home: package i'm looking for is not in backports

what are you needing to do?

duh. search for it instead of guessing, if you don't know.

Compiling a kernel?

No, just trying to load ncdu

aptitude search ncurses

ah. Thanks.

well, then it's backport building for you, I guess. which package are you looking for btw?

warsow and warsow-data

So much easier when you know how to search.

apt-cache search and antgel's

if you're lucky, it'll build with stable versions of its dependencies (sdl and whatever else)

!tell felix_da_cat about search

thanks was about to do that

itchy fingers…

update with .pdiffs is so slow.

yes
pdiff sucks if you don't update often

it doesn't use the bandwidth available, just cpu
should download it all first, then crunch away

i update every day, it's a lot faster

dont know if theres a better place to ask this… is there a way to make a single simlink that points to two dirs?

cool, thanks guys. That got me going.

cool

what do you mean?

jesus christ, i removed java because of its retarded depends on avahi, now some other stupid fucking package installs it

!kill avahi

yay for ubuntu maintainers!

!kill java

jelly-home: I'm trying to set up a dir to be served via apache, but half of everything is from rsync the rest is from svn.

so cerate a cymlink farm

jelly-home: if one of these dirs were 'static' then I would just pull from each as symlinks
jelly-home: but there both in flux daily

is sounds like you probably want some mod_rewrite magic to look in one place and if not found look in the other

then there's unionfs, but I have no idea how good is it

yeh i gave up trying to keep udev and avahi out of my box

not_benh, but the top point of each tree _is_ static

ohh had not though of that
yes the root of each dir is static just the innards that flux

so make a third rsynced tree with data from both?

not_benh, then you can symlink to those roots and let the rest change

/msg dpkg no public key

how do i stop mysql in debian/

jelly-home: thats a wonderful idea.

grr

I use this for custom icons with apache2: http://pastebin.ca/658412

mount a grassroots campaign and lobby for the removal

is it safe to delete the .list files under /var/lib/dpkg/info ?

NO

ok

no no no

I'll just delete the fscked one and reinstall then

long as it's not libc6.list…

cool thanks for the idea

neat

–clear-avail

how do i stop mysqld?

use the init script

use the force luke

Wow. If you haven't tried ncdu yet it is definately worth it. took less than 30 seconds to find the two large files that ate up my drive last night.

/etc/init.d/mysqld stop

ahh

anyone know a one-line way to convert a wma to an mp3?

thanks jetscreamer

unfortunately, when you put things like this in conf.d you still have to hack at the main apache.conf to get them to work as the conf.d stuff is loaded before the rest of apache's default settings. I truly don't understand why it's done that way.

i have. it's pretty neat. cleaned up my ~/ the other day with it

I was using mplayer to decode it then lame to encode it but I don't wanna do that now